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Work over Easter

Discussion in 'Workplace dilemmas' started by Progressnerd, Apr 20, 2019.

  1. steely1

    steely1 Occasional commenter

    I've done very little - I would have done more but this has not been a great holiday for me for personal reasons (which I won't go into here). I'm actually looking forward to returning to the routine of school, almost as a "distraction", so to speak. I hope that doesn't make me sound strange...

    Fortunately I work in a school where it's encouraged that staff and pupils get some down time during the holidays.
    sabrinakat, Curae, ATfan and 5 others like this.
  2. CWadd

    CWadd Star commenter


    I'm not back until the 29th, so have cleared two days to work this week.

    The comment about not deserving to be a teacher if you don't work in your own time reminds me of my former school. Where people used to book holidays for the whole of Easter and every half term so they had a reason not to attend revision days or come in for marking.
  3. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Contracted hours?

    My wife isn't a teacher. How many hours a week does she work? What does her contract say? Nothing about hours. Just what she has to do. And what she has to do takes ten hours or so a day. Nearly every day. Taking calls at night from all round the world. You name it. If she has a deadline then she barely seems to sleep.

    I can assure you that other workers also work very long hours and nobody gives a you-know-what about it. She isn't even unionised.

    Teachers needn't do half of it if they band together and make a stand! At least we have that option. Many workers don't. Challenge. Speak out. Yes, it may be awkward and uncomfortable. That's why you need solidarity. Someone has to be in the vanguard though. Maybe that someone needs to be you/us.
    Fleecyblanket and drek like this.

    SEBREGIS Lead commenter

    A friend of mine was HoD in a school where the rest of their department left. They had some new staff starting but they weren’t being paid until September. And they were all NQTs (I referred to this as ‘calling up the Volksturm’)

    At the very last minutes, the department was given a really big task of creating MAT format learning materials. When my friend pointed out that it was the last week of term and this would have to be done over the summer holiday AND there were no staff technically employed by the department, they were told to contact the NQTs starting next year and allocate it to them

    ‘What else are you going to do? Give them a little holiday?’

    Yes folks, that’s how our employers view our time.

    ‘I give him sixty hours and a piece of my soul,
    puts me somewhere at the bottom of his totem pole.’
  5. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    I can't legislate for stupidity, conformism, compliance, reluctance to rock the boat or an overriding desire to say nothing because one has a large mortgage to pay.

    I spent many fruitless hours reminding my colleagues (as union rep) that they didn't need to do x/y/z, shouldn't do it and that I would defend them to the best of my ability if they were to refuse and got into bother! I reminded them that I worked to contract and therefore the HT wouldn't target them as he knew the score (and wasn't a bar steward in the first place). I took that horse to water but couldn't force it to drink. I tried.

    We can all have a good old moan and it's not the easiest job in the world but there are things we can do so let's do them first. Moan later.

    Total respect to teachers who are balancing their workload and not allowing themselves to be mugs or doormats. No need to feel guilty. You've done nothing? That's great. You're organised, prepared and you've done it plenty of times before. Relax!
  6. TheOracleAtDelphi

    TheOracleAtDelphi Established commenter

    Gdw's point about other environments made me think...at my mum's place of employment, overtime is dependent upon grade - if you are a lower grade employee you are able to claim overtime payments (it used to be enhanced but I think it is just normal hourly rate now), the next band of grades can have TOIL and the very top level have a teacher-style 'any hours necessary to complete role' built in so they don't get payment or TOIL...on the other hand, although the company is very good at various different flexible working options, working from home is really only practical for middle or higher employees as everybody else would need to be on site...the SLT members I have known have in the large been very hard working (so this is not a criticism of them) but I do wonder whether there would be a shift in priorities in terms of some of the tasks teachers are expected to do if such a policy was adopted in schools (although the 1265 would need to be upped to something more realistic)

    Edited for predictive text typos
    agathamorse and Catgirl1964 like this.
  7. ATfan

    ATfan Star commenter

    1. Are you serious?
    2. Are you a troll

    In any case, I choose health, thank you very much! Been there, done that! Broke down and took 4 years to build myself back up again! Teaching jobs will come and go but my health didn’t come back to me easily once I damaged it, so I will continue to put that first, regardless of whether others agree with me or not!

    If your answer to 1 is yes and 2 is no, good luck to you! If your answer to 2 is yes, I suggest that you go to another thread as tbh, there is no food provided in this thread.
  8. sabrinakat

    sabrinakat Star commenter

    No work done by me yet; it's been lovely. :) I have had the kitten home for the last few weeks and we have spent time doing some KS1 revision, but he's back tomorrow and I HAVE THREE WHOLE DAYS TO VEG by myself and the cat :):):). I do have to do a past paper for 1st period Monday but it should only take an hour (terrible mark scheme).
  9. Teslasmate

    Teslasmate Occasional commenter

    I assume this is trolling. If it isn't, go forth and procreate. Teaching is a job. If it can't be done in 40 hours a week, it shouldn't be done.
  10. Piranha

    Piranha Star commenter

    If by "own time" you mean outside directed time, then STPCD expects you to. I am not sure if that is what this comment means.

    That is the big question, which has been debated before. Approximately 6½ hours a day for 195 days a year is significantly less than most full time workers do. But 50 hour plus weeks on a regular basis is clearly too much.

    For what it is worth, I was always happy to fit the odd hour or two of work into some days of a holiday, so that I could keep my workload at reasonable levels when term started. But I never felt guilty if I didn't.
  11. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    51.7. In addition to the hours a teacher is required to be available for work under paragraph 51.5 or 51.6, a teacher must work such reasonable additional hours as may be necessary to enable the effective discharge of the teacher’s professional duties, including in particular planning and preparing courses and lessons; and assessing, monitoring, recording and reporting on the learning needs, progress and achievements of assigned pupils.

    STPCD. How many times must one post this???

    If you can get it all done in the 1265 then that's great. Unlikely. But good for you. You've got it sussed. If you can't - then it takes as long as it takes.

    But don't let yourself be told how to plan.


    Ofsted does not require schools to provide individual lesson plans to inspectors. Equally, Ofsted does not require schools to provide previous lesson plans.

    Ofsted does not specify how planning should be set out, the length of time it should take or the amount of detail it should contain. Inspectors are interested in the effectiveness of planning rather than the form it takes.
    bevdex, agathamorse and BelleDuJour like this.
  12. caterpillartobutterfly

    caterpillartobutterfly Star commenter

    This is how most teachers are, I believe.
    ATfan and agathamorse like this.
  13. blazer

    blazer Star commenter

    Member since 2011 and this is only their 2nd post! A really lazy troll!
  14. blazer

    blazer Star commenter

    Or if it can't be done in 40 hours per week then those extra hours should be paid for!
    ATfan likes this.
  15. Piranha

    Piranha Star commenter

    Extra above what? STPCD just says "reasonable", and there is no mention of 40 hours, or any amount of time.
    grumpydogwoman likes this.
  16. sabrinakat

    sabrinakat Star commenter

    Only took 26 minutes * - my Latin is really improving ;)**

    *I did misplace my pen for 2-3 minutes, though....
    **unadapted Cicero but I think only @grumpydogwoman will appreciate that (IB HL unseen)
  17. ATfan

    ATfan Star commenter

    Reasonable means whatever managers say it means (and this changes when it suits them) in my experience which is why I am careful to note whether I am doing my full hours, what I am being asked to do and how long for if I am asked to do anything extra in my current job. If I’m taken over hours, I ask if I will get paid or TOIL or future flexibility with my workload in return. I have to do this as my experience is in FE, school 6th forms which do not follow ‘burgundy book conditions’ and at present an Indy. As painful as my back is at times, I am in one way glad of this as the experience has taught me to understand and express my limits. It also means that I cannot be coerced into doing anything which will strain it. Thus, I have become a more assertive person and am no longer quick to volunteer for stuff which will overload me (ofc, there are times when I do a bit extra to make life easier for myself or others but the point is, this is my choice and at a pace that I can cope with). As for the guilt, I realise that it is better not to overcommit, increase my pain levels and then have to disrupt others by having to rest in the classroom while they look after my students because I am in too much pain to teach them. Under promise and over deliver (without being lazy or a martyr) is my motto these days.
    agathamorse and Curae like this.
  18. Curae

    Curae Star commenter

    Procrastinating in TES.. never. Its just too valuable a source. WPD definiely helps. Take a, step back.. its a job You are human it will get done. Stay positive and do bit by bit. If you are late it will N O T be the end of the world.
    Cheer up and let us know how you are doing. The summer term is akways the best try and enjoy something about it eg long days less cold ect.
    jomaimai, agathamorse and Idiomas11 like this.
  19. Teslasmate

    Teslasmate Occasional commenter

    Yes, and reasonable is what the boss thinks, not what you think. You'd be astonished at some of the things described as reasonable by poor managers. 40 hours is what I think based on a standard 9 - 5 job.
    Oldfashioned and agathamorse like this.
  20. lovejoy_antiques

    lovejoy_antiques Senior commenter

    6 and a half hours a day performing in front of different groups of 30 kids is more draining than 12 hours putting up fences. I've done both jobs in this last year so feel adequately experienced and qualified to comment.

    I try to streamline the (teaching) work and try to be as brutally efficient as possible. Cutting out the faff helps. Names won't be on lollipop sticks and envelopes of jigsawed key words wont be available. Any task involving scissors and glue can be left to the keen PGCE students or have a go hero high end TA's.

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