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Why are there still **** teachers?

Discussion in 'Supply teaching' started by spiderwomen, May 5, 2012.

  1. spiderwomen

    spiderwomen New commenter

    There's loads of threads about the market, competition being high, supply teachers unemployable et, but my question is: Why are there still **** teachers teaching? Every Primary School in England has a few. The head knows who they are, and so do the staff and parents. These teachers are constantly bitched about in quiet corners in the staff room, and yet they continue to receive a salary between £30,000 to £40,000! Then there is the 'absent' teacher - the one who is always off ill for different maladies! This is just the run of the mill Primary School - and then they employ a completely useless NQT- generally young and inexperienced and can't control the class. When I first qualified, I got a job in the last week of term as the NQT they had employed didn't pass her course. I left the school for various reasons and went into supply. The last long term role I had was in a school covering a teacher on £50,000 a year who had been at the school for twelve years and never done a full year. She also refused to plan, got stressed really easily and so forth. In addition to this they put a young NQT into a challenging year six class who ate her alive and then spat her out. She went on sick leave and then left. I don't think these heads know what they are doing. Surely they would able to determine what makes a good teacher?
     
  2. spiderwomen

    spiderwomen New commenter

    There's loads of threads about the market, competition being high, supply teachers unemployable et, but my question is: Why are there still **** teachers teaching? Every Primary School in England has a few. The head knows who they are, and so do the staff and parents. These teachers are constantly bitched about in quiet corners in the staff room, and yet they continue to receive a salary between £30,000 to £40,000! Then there is the 'absent' teacher - the one who is always off ill for different maladies! This is just the run of the mill Primary School - and then they employ a completely useless NQT- generally young and inexperienced and can't control the class. When I first qualified, I got a job in the last week of term as the NQT they had employed didn't pass her course. I left the school for various reasons and went into supply. The last long term role I had was in a school covering a teacher on £50,000 a year who had been at the school for twelve years and never done a full year. She also refused to plan, got stressed really easily and so forth. In addition to this they put a young NQT into a challenging year six class who ate her alive and then spat her out. She went on sick leave and then left. I don't think these heads know what they are doing. Surely they would able to determine what makes a good teacher?
     
  3. I was one of those chewed and spat out NQT's. The whole experience left me feeling like a failure. But now I know a more about the education system. It is quite unbalanced

    sorry i know that this didn't answer your question.
     
  4. I think it is true that there are many heads who struggle with managing people. Possibly teachers don't make the best managers. I have worked p/t in a private school for three years and the headteacher is a business man. It is a wonderful place to work and I really love it (although pay is awful).
    However, I don't think the question is helpful. When I 'quit' teaching in 2009 I was not teaching well. I had been broken by bullying from SMT and an NQT who went out of her way to fit me up. She is still there and since has been promoted and demoted. I looked her up on rate my teacher recently and her rating is 1 with many students complaining about her being a poor teacher, impatient and a bully in the classroom. So why is she there? Well she was always brillant at saying she was doing things. I organised a trip to Paris and when I left she was organising a trip to Brussels... which never happened. She would send letters about after school sessions so SMT knew how 'wonderful' she was and why I was quietly helping students after school once staying until 7pm on my birthday I never saw her with one students as they just didn't turn up. Too many SMT buy the noise and us quiet grafters might get the odd box of chocs from our students and the respect of our immediate colleagues, but SMT don't notice us. Anyway now on long term back in the state sector and I am absolutely on fire... students doing well and I love it. The break did me the world, whilst the p/t teaching kept me up to date reference wise.
    So many of those people you are labelling '****' possibly need a break and some support. However if you are feeling that negative about education try and find something else to do for a bit. I went straight into an ma (although had redundancy to help with this) and it made a real difference.
     
  5. PaulDG

    PaulDG Occasional commenter

    I think that's true.

    The workload can be utterly crippling and if there are any elements of unreasonable pressure being applied, people's performance will suffer.

    In any other job, you could simply "take your time" a bit or go for a coffee when things get completely on top of you - in teaching, you have to deliver the timetable no matter what.
     
  6. It's tricky. I agree there are **** teachers. I worked alongside many. Examples 2 disorganised men who wound up the kids so much most others couldn't teach them but as they were men, authoritative and had booming voices they could command any class they wanted to in seconds. One a deputy and another a kS2 leader both were forced out when we got a new head with a hit list. Another brilliant teacher was forced into part time and bullied out resigning eventually. She had brilliant classroom management and teaching and got excellent results but she was off with stress a term most years and working alongside her I did most of the planning and prep. However I moved out of the school as I needed to relocate nearer my family. I lived the school, was always treated well, taught difficult y5/6 groups as well as bro g moved throughout ks2 as were we all, never had discipline problems etc. as I had reached threshold I wasn't getting interviews in my new area until I applied for management level jobs. I got 2 deputy interviews and took the first offered. So, off I went. As a KS2 trained and experienced teacher the head decided to give me the very difficult KS1 mixed age class and put an NQT trained as KS1 into the KS2 class. After 6 weeks of a sneaky TA reporting to the head every 5 minutes and the head popping into my class whenever she walked past it to assert her behaviour management skills I was left with a class with no respect for me. Couple this with exhaustion as I had no resources do spent many an evening laminating til early hours and my PPA being covered by a supply meaning I had to plan and resource the lesson myself talk g longer than the 2 hours I got out of my class I was not in a good state. Also over the course of the day I taught all year 1 for maths, all year 2 for English then my mixed class for afternoon topic. Why the school had 2 mixed classes was beyond me so I never had time to build up a relationship with my class. I also had a ks1 classroom set up like a ks2 classroom with no area for role play type activities. So one wet playtime as I was passing the dinner lady got me in a said she was walking, I went in to chairs being thrown and kiss fighting, by the end of lunch I was starving and still hadn't managed to calm them properly the TA arrived, shouted and the all stopped and listened. Hence I walked out leaving her to sort and ended up in tears in the heads office with her asking if I had ever read a behaviour management book!! I forgot to say I was 3 years into a 4 year psychology degree part time with the OU and have read most behaviour management material going!! So am I a **** teacher? NO. I was a badly managed experienced member of a longer established team who wasn't supported. After 6 months on the sick I was allowed to resign after bro g offered therapy my occupational help who also told me I was the x number deputy who had left this school in as many years. Turns out only NQTs survive there as they are brainwashed and current deputy started his career there. Head is on and off long term sick too. After a career break I am on supply, gradually trying to get my confidence back but losing faith in the system as I am too expensive for a permanent jOb.
     
  7. VelvetChalk

    VelvetChalk New commenter

    I have to agree with the OP on many points. As an NQT who cannot get a job or even an interview (My achilles heel is applications and I am working on this) it is very frustrating to see teachers than have given up/couldnt care less/ know how to tick the boxes without thinking about the children. On supply I have seen:

    Awful planning with no objectives/success criteria
    Working walls that havent been changed since October

    Awful classes with no behaviour management put in place
    teachers only using plans from books not even copied into a proforma
    Teachers ribing kids with sweets every lesson
    A class with no books on 'workseet folders' for literacy and numeracy
    A deputy who cannot control classes with a staff team that hate him

    Now Im only an NQT (one term experience so I have proven I can cope with the workload as I did reports and allsorts) but I know what should be going on in a classroom. I am sick of seeing people who know what to say at interview and know how to please people but have no grasp on teaching when theyre in the job. I actually had a teacher with many years experience ask a TA the other week 'IEPS arent that important are they? Ill just stick to the old one'. Yes, I agree so many teachers out there need the right support and guidance and have allowed to get into a rut but theres also some teachers out there that frankly...dont deserve their post.
     
  8. Anonymous

    Anonymous New commenter

    I think it's fascinating seeing other schools and a wide range of classrooms. It really has put my mind at rest when my ex head used to have a go at me. I have seen a whole range of planning from over the top in depth sublevelled full success criteria reams to a few notes. I have seen wonderfully decorated classrooms full of jargon through to minimum displays. Pupils who know what they should be doing through to year 6's who have not heard of clauses!!
    I have realised that I am actually a good teacher with high standards. All I need to do is convince a school of that which is difficult when you have been out of full time for 3 years and are on M6.

     
  9. Sorry, but LOL.
    Your entire post just screams that you're bitter and jaded: fine, but don't expect that to get you a teaching position ... xx
     
  10. internationalschools

    internationalschools New commenter

    Velvetchalk, as a HOD who has just recruited a new member of staff for my department, as well as teaching skills, one of the main things I was looking for was a colleague who was pleasant to work with and would fit into the team. If an NQT applied and thought they knew it all after one term of teaching, then they would not be hired. I work in an independent school which has fabulous A-level results, and none of the teachers have to have objectives on the board, written lesson plans or any of the other things which you would have been taught were essentials during your time on your PGCE. I'm not denying that there are teachers who are lazy and perform poorly, but I wouldn't link the teacher who does all the bureaucracy as necessarily being the best teacher.
     
  11. VelvetChalk

    VelvetChalk New commenter

    I feel a bit vilified here..

    I never said I knew it all or even close. I simply tried to explain (possibly with some clumsiness) because of my long term and short term supply experience I have a better idea of teaching requirements. I am suddenly accused of being unpleasant to work with (this has never been the case, in fact quite the opposite according to my references) because I have reported on what I have seen. I realise that standard practice can vary in schools (esp the independent sector) but a fellow teacher of mine got unsatisfactory for not display success criteria on the board and her written plan was deemed inadequate. We were all surprised because we all looked up to her as a wonderful teacher. I am certainly not a 'by the book' type of teacher but Ofsted unfortunately have a checklist and educational professionals have to adhere to these to avoid doubt of their teaching

    I also think people need to be a little considerate of how upsetting it is to be one of the many teaching graduates that search high and low for jobs for a while. Especially when you spend day after day on supply and being complimented on your teaching but getting nothing that progresses your career. I apologise if I've offended anyone but my professional confidence is low at the moment and I am speaking out for those feeling the same.

    I will not be posting in this thread again.
     
  12. I'm sorry you feel like that VelvetChalk. It is well known that people seem to feel free to say things on these sort of forums (all over the internet, not just TES ones) which they would not say face to face. Also, your words alone -- or even words plus emoticons -- don't convey what your tone of voice, facial expression and body language can do to modify your message. So people can get the wrong end of the stick and get all offended. I am in a very similar position to you, except that I haven't even had the one term as NQT that you had. And yes I have seen some teaching which I didn't find at all impressive, and I can remember thinking "How come that person gets a permanent job while I hardly ever even get shortlisted, let alone appointed?" But sometimes it is just necessary to keep quiet in order to avoid people thinking "And what would you know about it, you arrogant little so-and-so?" At the end of the day, we are all in a difficult situation and have to take the most positive attitude we can. Easier said than done! Don't give up.
     
  13. Hi Velvet chalk - actually your point about wall displays made me think - cos my classroom (which did belong to the HoD on maternity leave) has no displays and as this week is week 12 and next week is AWR week 1 decided to spend some time getting something up there. Not as bad as it sounds took a while to get to grip with the classes and I also sorted the classroom out locating a lot of missing coursework and sending them back to the right teachers who were really pleased as they were teaching kids who insisted they had done the work, but they didn't know where there were. Labelled draws and brought marking up to date, added grade criteria to every folder as none in there. I am lucky that the acting HoD is a wonderful leader and we cross plan as a team so planning and prep is minimal... Anyway thanks for the prompt and take care of yourself. It is so important to stay postive... and so hard to do it when you are worrying about bills and feeling rejection.
     
  14. anon8315

    anon8315 Established commenter

    I'm sorry that you feel 'got at' but I have to agree with this.
    By the way, we don't have learning walls in secondary so perhaps I'm speaking out of turn but I've never felt they are particularly helpful if I'm honest. I hope they don't sneak into secondary schools! [​IMG]
     
  15. anon8315

    anon8315 Established commenter

    Aww, I've read this properly now and I'm sorry - I think most of us do understand in fact, but in turn please also be considerate that teaching is extremely busy and it isn't always possible to cross every t and dot every i. I taught what was probably a fairly abysmal lesson on Friday: no one died or was seriously injured, but it WAS boring, had a vague lesson objective and didn't account for different types of learners - because I forgot about it! [​IMG] I share the group, they don't appear on my timetable and I got the shock of my life when they all suddenly appeared (I only just stopped myself blurting " what are you lot doing here?!")
    That doesn't mean I'm a bad teacher though - it was a one off and most of my lessons are well planned, honest!
    I'm a HOD and don't have my own teaching room (I do have my own office though [​IMG]) so the classrooms I teach in aren't necessarily reflective of my own standards. I just know I'd hate a supply teacher to come in and judge me on the above!
    Good luck finding a post x
     

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