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Who'd have known? Lily Allen and the relevant curriculum

Discussion in 'Education news' started by Vince_Ulam, Feb 13, 2016.

  1. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    A fine article from Tom Bennett.


    (Neither of the ladies above are Tom Bennett and only one is Lily Allen.)
  2. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    Good article. Almost everything could be argued as irrelevant to those without aspiration or interest in the world. On the other hand if you don't know anything and have no track record of being able to learn things, what use are you to anyone (apart from con-men)?
    If you've developed the skills to learn about percentages (and division by 12 -perhaps the 12 month year is a good reason for keeping multiplication tables to 12) then you don't really need to be taught about mortgages - although the inexorable market forces seem determined to make mortgages irrelevant for many.
    I owe my life to cellular biology specialists and people who know stuff about electromagnetic radiation, every time I drive up the road I could thank those who know a bit of stuff about geology and the properties of tars.
    Every time I go shopping, I can be grateful to the people who know about plant biology, soil science, fertiliser chemistry. I could go on.
    Knowing stuff makes the world more interesting.
    Being able to learn makes you important to the economy and able to enjoy the benefits of it.
  3. Scintillant

    Scintillant Star commenter

    Is it important not to generalise too much in these instances, but difficult not to

    For the children I deal with, a change in curriculum is necessary. They have had Shakespeare and quadratic equations thrown at them and it hasn't worked for a multitude of reasons. Now, you can keep pushing it and keep getting the same response, and we all know what a very intelligent man much in the news of late, said about that...

    Instead, along with the "basics" at an accessible level for those children, we actually deliver a lot of what is in that list of alternatives.

    Yes, I owe a lot of my life to some very intelligent people who taught me about evolution, genetics, the universe and everything, but similarly some of the young people who we've had through our doors owe their lives to us for simply keeping them in the education system - and safe and well - via an accessible curriculum until they can move on in their lives. And we're seeing more of these young people all the time.

    So I think there is room for both approaches. I'd go as far as to say we need both approaches to give the young people of this country the education that will provide the best outcomes for them. For some that will be knowing about conservation of momentum, for others it will be knowing how to deal with domestic violence and feeding themselves a reasonably healthy meal

    I guess that's why I have no time for Nick Gibb et al, and not all that much for Lily Allen.
  4. Flere-Imsaho

    Flere-Imsaho Star commenter

    By the look of that list we should make Guides and Scouts compulsory.
    What we need is not to keep changing the mainstream curriculum but to be able to respond more quickly to the minority for whom that curriculum is inaccessible - whether to provide an alternative or to provide support so that it becomes accessible a combination of both.
  5. les25paul

    les25paul Star commenter

    There's nothing on young Dave's "what to teach" list that shouldn't be there, its all useful stuff (I would also add how to correctly adjust the chain on a GT250 so thats its not too tight and wreck your sprockets). But with a few notable exceptions its all about to benefit Dave before anyone else. There is little there that will give Dave the skills to be of benefit to others in his community/society.

    But then Dave is a young lad and likely to grow out of his "ME ME" approach and appreciate the quote by someone famous (cannot be bothered to google it but think it was JFK) about not what my country can do for me but etc etc.

    If young Dave knew what an isotope was he would know why they are jolly useful and should be taught in school. He's got a cool hairstyle though :cool:
  6. redlamp2

    redlamp2 Occasional commenter

    For me the principle responsibility of schools (and therefore teachers) is to help children discover their talents and to inspire them to want to make a positive contribution to society. That means exposing them to lots of things they otherwise wouldn't get a chance to experience and then getting to a point of working towards mastering particular things they plan to do beyond their time in school.

    The principle responsibility of parents is to support and prepare their children to cope (and ideally thrive) in life.

    Of course teachers sometimes need to play the role of parent for various reasons. But it needs to always be clear where the responsibilities lie.

    I want teachers to be professional teachers. Not surrogate parents.

    I wouldn't want Nick Gibb or Lily Allen determining a school curriculum. Or Tom Bennett for that matter.
    Didactylos4 and Scintillant like this.
  7. Didactylos4

    Didactylos4 Star commenter

    I'd only add one thing to that list of responsibilities and that would be to teach them how to learn.
    (They don't have to enjoy doing so but they do have to know how)
  8. JaquesJaquesLiverot

    JaquesJaquesLiverot Established commenter

    Isn't meta-cognition quite high on Hattie's list of techniques when ranked by "impact"?

    The problem is that you don't know what's going to be useful. Cognitive psychologists tell us that there's nothing more important than knowledge because it helps us to understand and remember new things by helping us to interpret and put them into context - and that knowledge is more important for learning than reading ability.

    Lily might not have used Pythagoras' theorem directly since leaving school, but knowledge of its existence might have helped her to appreciate that maths is an ancient subject, to remember that Greeks once dominated early culture, and possibly to understand other things about triangles and square numbers.
  9. redlamp2

    redlamp2 Occasional commenter

    A bit like when you cut your toast into triangles and that thought always crosses your mind - 'thank **** for the Greeks'
  10. JaquesJaquesLiverot

    JaquesJaquesLiverot Established commenter

    More like when you cut your toast and wonder if the Greeks have done anything in the last 2000 years. Apart from Vangelis, Nana Mouskouri and Demis Roussos, of course.
  11. redlamp2

    redlamp2 Occasional commenter

    they still make nice yogurt
  12. xena-warrior

    xena-warrior Star commenter

    Bring back Secondary Moderns and Grammar Schools. But never never put it in those words.
  13. Didactylos4

    Didactylos4 Star commenter

    Probably (it's been a while)
    Not a problem if you know how to find out about something that turns out to be useful or needful.
    And it is so much easier (and so much harder) to learn that nowadays
  14. Lascarina

    Lascarina Star commenter

  15. Lascarina

    Lascarina Star commenter

    Damn- playback has been disabled. :(
  16. JaquesJaquesLiverot

    JaquesJaquesLiverot Established commenter

    Did you watch the video? It can be a problem if you don't know enough to make sense of what you find:


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