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What's The Point?

Discussion in 'Scotland - education news' started by subman68, Jun 26, 2015.

  1. subman68

    subman68 Occasional commenter

    OK last day and one last rant.

    Interview in my school for an acting post with whole school responsibility Cant say what it is, don't want to give to much away.

    2 going for it. (both female so no gender issue, the guys knew it would go to a woman :) )

    1. Does lots in the school, clubs, after school homework club, L&T group some other stuff. Really good things come out of this and the person is seen as someone that gets things done.

    2. In at the bell out at the bell, sometimes beats the kids out of school. Attendance issues and not great with the kids Is very friendly with SLT. Young.

    Who gets the job, yip you know it was number 2.

    I just don't see why we make people do all these extra things saying it makes a difference in landing a promoted post........it makes no difference. Smile and trot out the jargon of SQA/SE and you get the job. Blonde and pretty helps.
  2. bigjimmy2

    bigjimmy2 Lead commenter

    Subman, you just know you're going to get pelters . . .

    I've been teaching for a few years now and it never fails to surprise me just how little actual teaching is valued.

    And don't tell me "management" doesn't know who the "good" and "bad" teachers are - they will just choose to ignore "bad" teachers because there's very little they can do about it. The only thing management can do with "bad" teachers is to sack them, and even then it will be council management who have the say in that because school management don't have the authority. If our SLT folk were real managers they'd help poorer performing teachers into becoming better. But that's not on their remit or even their interest, is it?

    Maybe teaching is merely a focus of the "who you know rather than what you know" syndrome and that's why your young pretty blonde thing got the job. Suffice to say she'll get bored with that soon enough, screw it up and then either be found out or leave teaching altogether. Surely she couldn't progress any further in teaching, eh?

    The colleague next door to me got the Acting PC job earlier this week (which makes our PC dept completely female btw). As far as I know said colleague had never expressed an interest in PC before. Apparently she was a bit "overwhelmed" at "all the meetings" she was expected to participate in the next day - gosh! Has been teaching for less than four years, still stays with her parents yet wants to move into a position that allows her to "care" for children not really that much younger than herself. I've been thinking how pathetic that is for about fifteen years now. She's one of those that "cares" so much for her pupils that I can hear her tonsils rattling from next door almost every period.

    PS I haven't entered the gender debate because I don't have any real opinions on it other than there's an awfy lot of wummin teachers nowadays.
  3. gnulinux

    gnulinux Occasional commenter

    Not a gender issue???

    a. 'both female'

    b. 'the guys knew it would go to a woman'

    c. 'blonde and pretty helps'

    Get real!!!
  4. gnulinux

    gnulinux Occasional commenter

    No real opinions just egregious sexist prejudices!!! I do hope you are not a real teacher!!!

  5. It's this "nowadays" that gets me. I had one male Primary teacher and he was supply for a maternity leave. At Secondary the SMT were all male and there were men in most departments but unpromoted teaching staff were majority female. The numbers of promoted women has changed but there are still men in most departments in my school. And the majority in some.
  6. bigjimmy2

    bigjimmy2 Lead commenter

    No, not "egregious sexist prejudices!!!" - I would have said that about any obviously incompetent second-best-candidate regardless of their gender or other defining characteristic such as looks, hair colour, height, race, religious persuasion, sexual persuasion etc. You have missed my point, perhaps deliberately. I do hope you teach a factual-based subject because your interpretation skills are poor. See? I can do sarcasm too.


    OK, when I was at primary school there were more male teachers than female. There was only one male primary teacher when my own kids were at primary, he left so it became all-female.

    When I was at secondary school I had mostly male teachers, my female teachers were a significant minority but still very much that, in the minority. Again, my own kids had almost exclusively female teachers at secondary. Looking around my own school there is about a 70/30 split male/female in the teaching staff; an all-female PC department; and an almost all-female SLT.

    My point being that there has been an obvious shift in teaching becoming a "female" profession nowadays.

    Now do you get it?
  7. Can I ask when you started Primary? As I said, from my own experience (starting in late 70s) aside from a more balanced SMT, I don't see much difference. Is forty years "nowadays"?
  8. Are you yearning for a time when the gender balance was artificially tipped by the (often enforced) expectation that married women did not continue their jobs?
  9. bigjimmy2

    bigjimmy2 Lead commenter

    I as at primary around the same time as you.

    I'd imagine "nowadays" is nowadays, hence the word . . .

    I am not yearning for any time at all.
  10. An 8% rise between 1996 and 2005 for Secondary. Only 2% in Primary.
  11. I can't find figures for "nowadays".
  12. Christopher  Curtis

    Christopher Curtis Occasional commenter

    1974 I begin teaching.

    1976-1980 I am appointed to leadership positions such as English coordinator, timetabler, daily organiser and many more and am elected to the school council (the first of four school councils I serve on).

    1980 A three-person panel (including my principal, and a future director of industrial relations in the Victorian Education Department) gives me two highly recommendeds and one recommended for a senior teacher position (the top classroom classification in Victoria then).

    1981 I start at a new school and am elected to the school council.

    1981 I am appointed as one of the youngest senior teachers ever in Victoria in a different school.

    1982 I take up the position.

    1982-87 I serve as senior school coordinator, English coordinator, local administrative committee chairperson and much else besides and am elected to the school council.

    1988 I transfer as a senior teacher to a new school.

    1992 I am ?repromoted? to advanced skills teacher three (the new highest classroom level after the disbandment of the senior teacher class).

    1995 I am ?repromoted? to leading teacher (the new highest classroom level after the disbandment of the advanced skills teacher class).

    1988-1999 I serve as English coordinator, timetabler, year 12 coordinator, literacy coordinator, teaching and learning coordinator and much else besides.

    1990 I am appointed acting vice principal.

    1992 I am appointed acting vice principal.

    2000 I am appointed leading teacher in a new school.

    2000-2004 I serve as timetabler and daily organiser and am elected to the school council in that school.

    During my time as a teacher I apply for a number of principal class positions:

    ?Chris Curtis impressed the panel...His written application, references and interview demonstrated outstanding organisational and management skills and commitment to maximising the educational outcomes for students??

    (XXX SC Senior Campus Principal Selection Panel report, 1994, which ranks me second for the position, after the internal applicant)

    ?The panel commends this candidate for his devoted work in curriculum and administration. His knowledge in curriculum is excellently founded and his English work outstanding. He has excellence in timetabling and his work for staff is first class...?

    (YYY SC Principal Selection Panel report, 1996)

    ?Chris demonstrated objectivity, sensitivity and integrity to the highest degree. The

    panel was most impressed by the personal values he demonstrated.

    ?The capacity for organisation, management and decision-making demonstrated by Chris was outstanding. His ability to build a cohesive team was impressive?.??

    (ZZZ SC Assistant Principal Selection Panel, which places me second to the two internal applicants being upgraded, 1999)

    2002 Having saved the school some $208,000 by getting it to rescind an unworkable curriculum structure and adopt a workable one on the third last day of the previous school year, I am purportedly dismissed from my role as timetabler as the school needs a scapegoat for its mind-boggling incompetence by an acting principal who has been in the school for one week and will last for only ten weeks in total and am replaced by four people ? an assistant principal, two assistant timetablers and a consultant ? perhaps indicating how much work is involved in timetabling. (It?s a long story and not the point of my post, though I must point out that the person in that foursome who ends up taking on the main role is given a time allowance three and a half times mine for the same job.)

    2002 The school is ordered to re-instate me by the Merit Protection Board, an order the newly appointed principal tells me he will follow as he can see exactly what has been done to me, but an appeal stops him taking up the position, and the school, now under its sixth principal in two and a quarter years, refuses to comply with the MPB order until I lodge a second grievance with the MPB over the schools? refusal to abide by the first order.

    2002 Having been re-instated and with a new principal in the school (the seventh in two and half years), I apply for an acting assistant principal position at my school. The panel, oblivious to every reference, report and fact of the previous 28 years, determines that I do not meet even one of the criteria for the position.

    I go on to give that school the most coherent curriculum structure it has had (adopted in a vote with the support of 71 per cent of the teachers) but never apply for another promotion position, am demoted altogether in 2005 at the end of my leading teacher tenure (costing me roughly some $50,000 in salary and superannuation), spend the last two years being responsible for such demanding tasks as making sure the CFA inspects the fire extinguishers and watching as my replacement removes the coherence that I have managed to get into the timetable, resign before I even turn 55 and go to work as a casual tutor training future teachers at a university graduate school of education that treats its employees decently (making up for most of the $50,000 ?fine? for being right).

    My point is not to seek sympathy or blow my own trumpet but just to point out that, while I often point to the better features of Victorian education compared with the UK, there is no consistency or justice or even rationality in how teachers are promoted here. You may be highly regarded in lots of schools and be used up and spat out by another.
    rooberoo likes this.

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