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Those Africans who sold their own people into slavery...

Discussion in 'Personal' started by Wanda_the_Wonder, Jul 9, 2020.

  1. Wanda_the_Wonder

    Wanda_the_Wonder Occasional commenter

    How do we today register meaningful condemnation of those Africans who sold their own people into slavery?
    Thorny issue.

    Facing up to this does not exculpate in any way the nations who engaged in the slave trade - but the truth is that slaves were bought and slaves were sold.

    Retired Archbishop Of York, John Sentamu, has regularly expressed his disgust at the African chiefs and societies who sold their own people into slavery.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/nov/18/africans-apologise-slave-trade
     
  2. oldsomeman

    oldsomeman Star commenter

    Sush! It's not mentioned. Only other nations enslaved Africans and thr trend is to blame white nations when as it has been pointed out on these forums slavery is not just white on black but a whole range of colours, including black on black.
    Slavery is happening all over the world, even in our own country and society. The tragedy is that slavery is not decried in all its forms, rather than a selective few.
     
    ACOYEAR8, Alice K, hhhh and 2 others like this.
  3. Wanda_the_Wonder

    Wanda_the_Wonder Occasional commenter

     
  4. Wanda_the_Wonder

    Wanda_the_Wonder Occasional commenter

    'Sush! It's not mentioned.'

    Well, I think it should be mentioned. I applaud the honesty of the retired Bishop of York and others who draw attention to this historic and monstrous wrong.
     
    ACOYEAR8, Alice K, WB and 2 others like this.
  5. sbkrobson

    sbkrobson Star commenter

    "I didn't punch you, how is it my fault when you walked headfirst into my fist?!"
     
  6. burajda

    burajda Star commenter

    I went to Ghana some years ago and visited a slave fort at Elmina. It was gruesome, but the local guide made it quite clear that some native tribes and benefitted from the trade and that slavery had been a centuries old part of West African society.
    The Arabs and Ottomans had been trading slaves on a large scale for many years before and after the Europeans. Organised by the state or freelancers their slaving activities extended from India and East Africa and the Balkans and included taking slaves from the coasts of France, Britain and Ireland and even as far away as Iceland. It was the French navy in the late 1700s that really cleared the Arab or Barbary slavers out of the their waters and in doing so ours.
    Hopefully Mr Erdogan will make a full apology for his country's disgraceful slaving history.
     
    ACOYEAR8, Alice K, WB and 2 others like this.
  7. Symingtons

    Symingtons Occasional commenter

    It was certainly mentioned in all the KS3 textbooks I saw being used, and in the various TV programmes on the subject (incl. the BBC one in the 'History File' series).
     
    WB likes this.
  8. magic surf bus

    magic surf bus Star commenter

    Did those who sold slaves to Europeans actually think of themselves as 'African' in the sense of identifying with everyone else on an entire continent? The title implies a degree of ethnic solidarity that probably wasn't there.

    More likely they were people who regarded the inhabitants of neighbouring territory with suspicion or even contempt.

    Of course, the Atlantic slave trade couldn't have happened without their collusion, and that's part of the story, but I doubt if they considered their captive human commodities as 'their own people'.
     
    Oscillatingass likes this.
  9. Symingtons

    Symingtons Occasional commenter


    I suspect it could - though with more difficulty and less profit. European slave traders would have landed and used their superior weaponry to seize Africans from coastal settlements. Of course the fear that they would do this was one factor in encouraging the coastal living Africans to co-operate and seize slaves to sell to the Europeans.
     
  10. Wanda_the_Wonder

    Wanda_the_Wonder Occasional commenter

    'Of course the fear that they would do this was one factor in encouraging the coastal living Africans to co-operate and seize slaves to sell to the Europeans.'[/QUOTE]

    Sorry, but this really is not true. And in any case no excuse for what they did.
     
    Nellyfuf2 likes this.
  11. Katzenjammer

    Katzenjammer Occasional commenter

    How do we today register meaningful condemnation of those Africans who sold their own people into slavery?

    By not buying, wearing or using products which are manufactured by modern slave labour - sugar, cotton, coffee, tobacco, cattle, rice, fish, bricks, clothes, textiles, footwear, carpets, fireworks, gold, coal and diamonds; or by accepting that, if we want such products, we should ensure that we pay a price for them which enables the payment of decent wages to those who work at their manufacture.

    All else - waving banners, taking a knee, spray-painting statues, knocking down monuments and throwing them in the river, chanting slogans at television cameras - is mere attitudinising, designed to make those striking the attitudes feel better. "Meaningful condemnation" means taking action that costs.
     
  12. oldsomeman

    oldsomeman Star commenter

    If the history I read was correct, although initially, Europeans may have enslaved some Africans, the main slave collection was by Arabs as mentioned. That we took and used/abused such folks is down to the social mores of the captures and users.
    Despite a distaste for the actions of the past, we do now condemn such practices even if some folks among use have slaves here for exploitation. I dislike immensely attempts to blame the mistakes of 300 plus years past upon our generations. Yes, the results might live on,but the cause was not ours although we might learn from such things and seek not to enslave,amongst other things.
     
    ACOYEAR8, Alice K and lexus300 like this.
  13. Symingtons

    Symingtons Occasional commenter


    I'm not sure the Arabs from North Africa enslaved many down in the 'Slave Coast' (the Gulf of Guinea in West Africa), several thousand kilometres from where the Arabs lived.
     
  14. catbefriender

    catbefriender Lead commenter

    Not usually their own people, but the people they disowned i.e. their criminals or the prisoners of war from a tribe they fought and won. To some white people, all blacks are the same people/group, but they are not. They are all different tribes. In Nigeria there are over 150 tribes and languages and they don't all get along. It's like the Scottish and the English, who have throughout history, not been the best of friends. And even in Scotland, they have their clans, which is a bit like tribes.

    The British sent their criminals to Australia, Canada and America etc. It was all the rage back in those days, sending people who were thought of as undesirables,far, far away. And a lot of those discarded people ended up being jewels.
     
  15. Wanda_the_Wonder

    Wanda_the_Wonder Occasional commenter

    'They are all different tribes.'

    I hear what you say. However those Africans selling the slaves could hardly fail to notice that all those being sold were black and all those buying them were white.
     
  16. lexus300

    lexus300 Star commenter

    Report this to BLM.
     
  17. burajda

    burajda Star commenter

    They did, for centuries West African slaves were traded by land across the Sahara. East and Central Africans and Ethiopians by sea. The Arabs did this before during and after the well known European slaving period, probably into the late 19th century only ceasing large scale as the Western Europeans parcelled out the continent slaving went on into the 20th century but much reduced. Indians, Indonesians, Chinese as well as Europeans were all enslaved by Arabs at different periods..
     
    ACOYEAR8 likes this.
  18. burajda

    burajda Star commenter

    Yes. I'm sure my English ancestors played no part in the slave trade and saw little direct economic benefit from it. They were miners, agricultural workers and river workers struggling in harsh working and living conditions and were certainly exploited. No, I dont feel any need to apologise and have no need to be guilty about British Slavery.
     
  19. burajda

    burajda Star commenter

    The Europeans didnt go far from their ports and slaving forts. The weaponry was useless in the forest, money was very useful. Usually Africans collected the slaves for them. The lives of the ordinary European men who worked in Africa, were short as most fell sick or died soon after arrival. Most were easily replaceable and unlike the slaves had no value at all to their employers.
     
  20. WB

    WB Lead commenter

    The Arab slave trade ( some say more slaves went to the Middle East than America) and the fact that most slaves were sold into slavery by Africans (the image of white people running around Africa with nets is false) are well known and well documented facts of history.

    But they are not part of the debate as they don't fit the narrative that many people subscribe to and to deviate from the given narrative is not allowed. This closes down discussion. I don't want to be part of a discussion where one side decides what can and can't be discussed - that's not a discussion, that's a lecture.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2020
    Alice K and Oscillatingass like this.

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