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The problem with teaching...........

Discussion in 'Personal' started by BelleDuJour, Oct 19, 2017.

  1. dleaf12

    dleaf12 Occasional commenter

    What @BelleDuJour said.. x100!! Nailed exactly why I left early last July. - but much more succinctly!

    The devaluing of vocational courses is one of the most evil legacies from the Gove nightmare.
    Society needs "hewers of wood and drawers of water" and they should be valued just as much as the brainiacs.

    One size does NOT fit all when it comes to education.
  2. oldsomeman

    oldsomeman Star commenter

    40 years ago I argued when teaching in a comprehensive in east London that not all children should be aimed at university. I was po o pooed that was unfair to the children.Yeah? In those days they didn't like school and skived off to work when they could.How much then we needed an alternative path such as vocational studies or a practical set of courses.Not all are Uni material......and then i argued for children to be allowed back into school after they had left at 16.so to continue studies when they suddenly realised they needed more not less of education.
    Not much has changed in the last 40 years except,despite out efforts, children are not being helped fully into becoming thinking,caring and responsible people.
  3. needabreak

    needabreak Star commenter

    I disagree that students should not all have a shot at uni. Most teachers I know went to uni but made mistakes along the way, they could have been left by the wayside if not encouraged to persevere.

    I do agree that students are not all ready at the same time but to write off 80% of the population would certainly add to the teacher shortage for starters...

    University teaches much more than the course content. Many students mature there in a fairly safe environment... They learn indepedence amongst other things.

    By not valuing all unis we make a mistake. Some are not red brick but churn out very employable young people... Some more so than traditional courses from ancient unis.
  4. Lara mfl 05

    Lara mfl 05 Star commenter

    How true.
  5. lardylady

    lardylady Star commenter

    I teach in Primary but some of the threads on here when the GCSE results came out made me stop and think just how times really have changed. When I got a D in my Biology O Level back in '83, it would never have crossed my mind for even a nanosecond that the blame lay at my Biology teacher's door. I blamed myself for not revising hard enough. I didn't have after school sessions, revision sessions and all that malarkey (well, we didn't back then, did we?) I just got on with it and just accepted that some subjects weren't my strong suit. I currently teach Year 2 and have already been taken to task because a child in my class has not made enough progress in Maths in the last 7 weeks. Roll on retirement, I say. Pity it won't be until 2027.
  6. BelleDuJour

    BelleDuJour Star commenter

    I'll see the year out. For my students.
    thistledoo and Lara mfl 05 like this.
  7. BelleDuJour

    BelleDuJour Star commenter

    Exactly my point.
    Its wrong......just wrong on all levels that all we do in school is teach young people it is always someone else's fault.
    thistledoo, dleaf12, tonymars and 4 others like this.
  8. needabreak

    needabreak Star commenter

    There were some exceptions, namely having to teach myself A'levels *without the existence of the internet and books being unaffordable to me (and the school and local libraries it seemed), with no such thing as "intervention"... during much of the strike action in the 1980's.
  9. housesparrow

    housesparrow New commenter

    What a fantastic OP and subsequent comments. In today's blaming and litigious culture, if a student does well they worked hard and if they do badly it's the teacher's fault. Just not fair and doesn't teach students ownership of their learning.
  10. secretsiren

    secretsiren Star commenter

    Indeed. How many of us have not thought 'there goes my pay rise/job security' when you see that Jimmy with 50% attendance has a target of a 7? Or felt surges of real rage when you explain that Jimmy will definitely not get their target grade because the school has set a really unrealistic target and you're told off for being negative? Or felt sick the night before results come out because you know it's going to decide whether you have a decent year at work or whether you're suddenly going to be subjected to additional observations, learning walks, meetings, tracking of data, performance targets and monitoring as if you've overnight become rotten at your job? Or felt like smacking a child because they say 'ah well, Miss, I only need a 4 to get into college so I don't care if I get the target of a 6' because you know they're muffing up your progress figures? Or had a rage-cry after ringing a parent who chuckles gaily at your complaints at lack of revision and says 'well, I wasn't very good at that subject either' and then tells you about their haemorrhoids?

    And I've even had children ask if they fail, what happens to me. Not THEM. Me. That is so completely stupid.
    tenpast7, thistledoo, Lazycat and 6 others like this.
  11. Lara mfl 05

    Lara mfl 05 Star commenter

    Ooh @housesparrow, I know it says 'new commentator but I'm sure I remember you form way back.

    And then @secretsiren posts below yours.
    Starting to feel like old times.;)
    needabreak likes this.
  12. needabreak

    needabreak Star commenter

    Looks like house sparrow left teaching *from other posts earlier in the year... don't blame them.
  13. Dunteachin

    Dunteachin Star commenter

    And 30 yr olds become Assistant Headteachers or Heads...
  14. Mangleworzle

    Mangleworzle Star commenter

    The only thing I regret about leaving is not having done it earlier.

    Slowly things moved from one side of the see-saw to the other.

    Doing worthwhile work v doing useless work I was told to.
    Being appreciated v a culture of never-quite-good-enough
    Being trusted v an assumption my motives were selfishness and laziness.
    An assumption I had done as expected v an assumption I had done nothing unless there was an indisputable paper trail.
    A fair days work for a fair days pay v less pay for more work.
    Time in the job meant valuable experience v time in the job meant no ambition and a failure to progress.
    etc. etc.
  15. Duke of York

    Duke of York Star commenter

    Do any of you ask yourselves whose interest it is in to have every child attend university these days, when very few of my generation went to university, yet got by more successfully than today's graduates?

    Who actually funds the loans to pay for tuition fees? How much are they making out of it and what might be the consequences if students decided en masse, not to go to the degree factory in order to live without a lifetime of debt?

    Would the world stop turning? Of course it bleedin' wouldn't. Employers would still need workers and they'd just have to go back to selecting them on the basis of whether they felt job applicants were likely to be up to the job after they've been trained for it.

    It seems to escape every's attention that no matter how good a degree an individual has or where they went to earn it, they all have to be trained in the workplace to do real life jobs.

    As someone who employed people in various capacities, I've had to train all of them to do what was required of them. I found no difference whatsoever in their potential whether they had been to university or not, other than the fact that those who had the university education believed they were more valuable and would somehow entitle them to a stay of execution if they messed the company about.

    It seems to me this target-driven culture in schools, serves only one master. To keep the finance industry afloat. The more the finance industry screws up, the more desperate it gets to put pressure on the education production line to produce more widgets it can profit from.
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2017
  16. housesparrow

    housesparrow New commenter

    My status was somehow reset to new commentator when the site was upgraded, yes I did leave teaching and am still very glad I did. I pop on here now and again when I've not had such a good day at work to remind myself how much better off I am out of teaching. I feel very sorry for those of you who are still stuck in teaching and would rather be elsewhere.
  17. Calpurnia99

    Calpurnia99 Star commenter

    It was a lovely job when I started in 1979. I left in 2006 partly because everything Belle says was already in process but mainly because I hated the HT and what he'd done to the school, the kids and the staff.
    I could not go back to it now. There's nothing I see in the classroom now i recognise from my teaching days. It changed and I couldnt. Because it changed for the worse.
  18. oldsomeman

    oldsomeman Star commenter

    Seems like me you caught up on learning after you left school
    I started out to be a teacher by going to night school for 4 nights a week to do my O levels then another 3 nights a week the following year to sit my A levels. I did have good night school teachers and they helped me along the way, but it was a graft.I remember sitting in a Liverpool library and reading all the past questions in the subjects I was covering , both in O and A levels........no computers,or mobiles. no hand outs.All copied off the board or read in books LOL..sheer dam slog to learn it all from books. and then writing out test essays on each subject over and over so I would succeed.
    Then 3 years of slog to do a certificate in teaching.Five years to continually graft to become what to my mind was wonderful profession.I am still proud of the community of teachers, and still feel we are still one of the most undervalued professions.
  19. ilovesooty

    ilovesooty Lead commenter

    I am so glad I don't teach any more. I feel privileged to do what I do now. I work with great people, I love what I do and I don't feel sick with fear going to work any more. I wouldn't return for ten times the salary.
  20. Duke of York

    Duke of York Star commenter

    From what I've seen, pretty well everything you can say about how teaching has changed is endemic everywhere. We have a target-driven economy whose sole aim is to milk it while it can and the final goal will ultimately be the lowest possible denominator.

    Whichever way you look at it, the quality of life is getting poorer day by day and there doesn't seem to be a political party that is interested in tackling this fundamental flaw in today's life.

    It doesn't matter where you look, we are getting less value for our money than we did in the past.

    I despair when I visit the supermarket, having known what folk were dining on when I was young and worked out what I could afford when I retire. I despair also that a family of today couldn't feed their kids as well as I fed mine, even in the darkest days of the Wicked Witch of Westminster's rule.

    I look at what people load onto supermarket conveyors to feed their screaming brats with and can see their kids have probably never had a Sunday roast like kids of my generation did

    My residents get it in the form of a frozen, microwoven dinner that a hard-pressed carer barely has the time to wait until the dinger goes dong before she has to be off to her next client.

    She'll be trying to meet targets too.

    Nothing is going to change until the entire system gets rebooted and we rid ourselves of the parasites that are dragging us down.

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