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The parents of six murdered two teenage sons-but should they have been charged with incest earlier?

Discussion in 'Personal' started by Weald56, Nov 12, 2019.

  1. Weald56

    Weald56 Established commenter

    I have always assumed that sex with a half-sibling would be incest, and therefore a crime. So why weren't these two arrested after their first child was born, and imprisoned. Might have saved his life. And what seems to have been a life of abuse

  2. nizebaby

    nizebaby Star commenter

    Are you sure of your facts? There's a lot of surprising info on the web.
  3. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter

    Not quite Jamie and Cersei.
  4. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    How the kids got to that age without being "taken" by social services defies belief!
    schoolsout4summer and Weald56 like this.
  5. Weald56

    Weald56 Established commenter

    I guess that's my view too.
  6. Weald56

    Weald56 Established commenter

    It seems clear the 'parents' are half-brother & sister. it is clear they tried to murder all their children and succeeded in killing too.

    As far as I know half-siblings who have sex are committing incest. In which case, why weren't they arrested, charged, convicted and punished to stop them breeding (to put it crudely, but accurately)?
  7. florian gassmann

    florian gassmann Star commenter

    How would their relationship have come to the attention of the police?
    chelsea2 and LondonCanary like this.
  8. Weald56

    Weald56 Established commenter

    Given the paperwork completed when e had children (nearly 30 years ago), and the monitoring that happened - which I understand is even more thorough today - I'd have expected the health professionals and/or social services to have investigated and reported it. It seems highly likely this 'family' was known to both the police and social services.
  9. mothorchid

    mothorchid Star commenter

    Horrific story. So much wrong and so many horrible aspects.
  10. Bedlam3

    Bedlam3 Star commenter

    Poor kids they must have been terrified. It's horrific.
  11. blazer

    blazer Star commenter

    The family must have known.
  12. Weald56

    Weald56 Established commenter

    A family member claims they reported their concerns, but were ignored.
  13. florian gassmann

    florian gassmann Star commenter

    The paperwork would have shown that the father and mother had different surnames - nothing suspicious there.

    Reported to social services, rather than the police, apparently. I doubt that social services will ever say why they took no action, but we don't even know if the report was one of incest or simply concern over childcare.
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
  14. Weald56

    Weald56 Established commenter

    Perhaps. But I am not convinced that their relationship wasn't well known in the community and by those dealing with them.
    grumpydogwoman likes this.
  15. nizebaby

    nizebaby Star commenter

    Incest between siblings is legal in n many countri s, including australia.
  16. Weald56

    Weald56 Established commenter

  17. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Never mind the incest. How about the cruelty? I am sure this family must have been known to social services.
    monicabilongame, nizebaby and Weald56 like this.
  18. florian gassmann

    florian gassmann Star commenter

    I doubt that we will ever know. Neither social services nor any other witnesses were called to the trial as both defendants pleaded guilty.
  19. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    Incest between consenting adults, when neither is a vulnerable person being abused, must come very low down police priorities. There are very few prosecutions in those circumstances and those that appear if you search online all seem to involve another family member reporting it to the police. Even if medical professionals knew it's unlikely they would report it to police, in the absence of abuse or coercion.

    My daughter has had children recently and nothing that she was asked by the medical professional would have revealed if the father was a half sibling if they hadn't wanted to volunteer the information (for clarity, her husband is not a half sibling!).

    And having different surnames wouldn't flag anything - about half of all births in England are to unmarried parents who presumably mostly have different surnames.

    So if you suspected that a couple living in your road might be half brother and sister the first thing you'd do is report them to the police for committing an offence under the Sexual Offences Act 2003? Seriously?
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
  20. catbefriender

    catbefriender Lead commenter

    @grumpydogwoman They were definitely known and the mother and father, had both been in care. The mother vowed that she would rather kill her children than put them into care as she knew there were moves to put them all into care. She said, according to the DM, 'I gave them life so I can take their lives.'

    Apparently there will be a SCR (Serious Crime Review) and I guarantee the phrase, 'Lessons have been learned,' will appear and nobody from social services will be sacked.

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