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The 5 year rule

Discussion in 'Supply teaching' started by emmalcm1, Nov 22, 2015.

  1. emmalcm1

    emmalcm1 Established commenter

    I finished my PGCE in Summer 2011 and have managed to do 2 terms of my NQT but haven't been able to get the third done. Due to lack of jobs for my subject all I've done is supply work (some long term) since qualifying and for this reason I am currently looking for non-teaching jobs. I went for an interview for a civil service job a few weeks back and the response was that I reached the required standard but due to the number of applicants who did they have put me on their reserve list for a job (which does happen as my husband was put on their reserve list and later offered a job). I am looking around for other things but not getting very far with the lack of jobs in general.

    Is it still the case that you can only do 5 years of supply without completing your NQT year? Does it make any difference that I've done 2 terms of it? I'm just starting to get a bit concerned that I may not find something else by Summer and I cannot be in a position where I'm not able to work. My husband works so I wouldn't be in a position to claim anything (not to mention I'd rather not anyway) and we would struggle without me at least earning something as a top up. I've had a look online but can't find much about it.

    I spoke to a supply teacher recently who said he hadn't done his NQT and had been qualified for more than 5 years but his agency had allowed him to continue to work.

    Any info appreciated!
     
  2. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    http://www.teachers.org.uk/files/induction-guide-20pp-2015-web.pdf

    You can teach on supply on a short term basis (placements of less than a term's length) for a 5 year 'window' from gaining QTS.
    Most newly trained teachers finished their courses in June/July and gained QTS OFFICIALLY IN THE aUGUST, READY FOR THE START OF THE ACADEMIC YEAR.

    aSSUMMING THAT YOU GOT qts IN aUG 2011, YOU HAVE UNTIL aUGUST 2016 to be employed on short supply posts, whether direct with a school or via an agency.

    Any supply post (p/t or f/t) that is intended to last for at least a term's length (from any point in one term to at least the same stage of the next term) MUST be conducted on an Induction basis, with the requisite 10% timetable reduction. That applies to agency work as well.

    The 5 year rule replaced the previous 16 month rule.

    If you are not on an final Induction term at August 2016, you cannot be employed as a teacher again UNTIL you secure Induction work (no time limit on that!).

    You CAN be employed as a Cover Supervisor.

    I'd suggest canvassing any schools in your travel to Work area where you haven't yet been 'introduced' by an agency. Send them your CV and tell them you are available for short-term, long-term, full and part time work.

    You can complete Induction in any subject that you feel competent to teach but the same standards will be expected as of a specialist
     
  3. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    The supply teacher that you spoke to is probably being employed as a CS.

    I fell foul of the previous 16 month supply rule in 2001. The rule then allowed you to work on supply for 16 months with an incomplete or unstarted Induction .
    I was warned by the Dept of Education that I must not work as a teacher until I could get an Induction term organised. At the time there was an official pay category for completely unqualified teachers. I asked if I could work as unqualified . They said I'd be lying on an application form if I didn't disclose my qualified status and would be open to prosecution! I pointed out that I faced unemployment. No solution offered.

    I ended up signing on at the office where I'd previously worked! I then took work with Royal Mail on the Xmas post and eventually found somewhere to complete Induction (actually one of my Teaching Practice schools).
     
  4. emmalcm1

    emmalcm1 Established commenter

    Thanks @jubilee I thought that was the case. The supply teacher I was talking to said he was still working as a teacher so I presume he too could be prosecuted if he was found out. It's wrong when you've paid to do the training, I can't think of any other jobs where your qualification can be in essence taken away from you like that (it might as well be if you can't use it).

    It annoys me that if that was the case I could work as a cover supervisor but not a teacher since sometimes I am employed as a cover supervisor as it is and realistically I am often doing the same job as I would be as a day to day supply teacher.

    I think at this stage I would rather leave teaching anyway but I really am starting to get worried about whether I'll find something in time as there are next to no jobs in general being advertised in my area.
     
  5. elvispenhaligon

    elvispenhaligon Occasional commenter

    The agencies are quite happy to overlook things if they're onto a good money spinner. I speak from going over the line myself.

    When qualitymark, or whoever comes around, they show them a fancy database showing everyone's not a paedo and then the girls in short skirts keep them busy whilst they enjoy their tea and biscuits.
     
  6. historygrump

    historygrump Star commenter Forum guide

    I believe there is also a way around the 5 year rule, in that if you join the Society for Education and training (cost around £70 a year) and apply for the QTLS accreditation, which normally applies to FE qualified teachers, then under the present regulations, once QTLS is awarded then you have equal status to QTS and can work in schools without restriction. It takes around 6 months and some support evidence to apply for your QTLS, I hope this helps.
     
  7. TheoGriff

    TheoGriff Star commenter

  8. historygrump

    historygrump Star commenter Forum guide

    What I find annoying about the 5 year rule is that in Wales they take into account the time spent working on supply and this goes to the induction period, so in theory you could spend 5 yeas working supply and pass your induction. In England they are not listening to teachers and I was part of a campaign group that help get the 5 year period rule, the unions opposed it, so did the civil servants and political parties. We never achieved our main aim of banning the use of unqualified CS, but we felt the induction period was unfair and unjust, so we fought on that is issue as well.

    I still think the induction period is unfair, in that such a rule does not apply to other professionals and after qualifying and passing the official observations, you should be seen, recognised and treated as a qualified professional teacher, and not asked to undergo further tests to prove that you can do the job..

    Also if you come from the EU you are not required to do an induction period at all and this rule if my memory serves me right, also applies to teachers from the US, Canada, Australia and New Zealand. So a qualified teacher can come from certain overseas countries and teach without any restrictions, yet British teaches are openly being discriminated against, as if the politicians and civil servants is a poor training system. This despite Briitish teachers are often seen as among the best trained in the world.
     
  9. emmalcm1

    emmalcm1 Established commenter

    Wow I had no idea about that! That's so unfair that the rule is different in Wales! It's also appalling that teachers can come from other countries without restriction like that while we have the rule to deal with-like you say, it's open discrimination.

    I've always thought that there should be a way of taking time on supply into account. I mean the things I've seen and dealt with in schools in the last few years has to mean something. I have a different sort of experience that someone who'd gone straight into a permanent job wouldn't have. I have literally done anything and everything but it doesn't seem to count for much when there is a job that comes up (although it's not very often!).
     
  10. emmalcm1

    emmalcm1 Established commenter

    Thank you, I will look into it
     
  11. emmalcm1

    emmalcm1 Established commenter

    Thanks @TheoGriff . As I wrote in a post above, I really do think it's most unfair. I and everyone else in the same situation paid to do the qualification. I know I'm a good teacher having been told so by lots of schools and repeatedly asked back, yet I have to prove it by getting someone to sign to say so. It's a bazaar thing to do to get you to pay for a course then say oh no you need to pass this extra bit or you can't use the qualification. I can't think of any other courses like that.
     
  12. TheoGriff

    TheoGriff Star commenter

    .

    And the really bizarre thing is that if you don't do the induction year at all, or do it and fail it, you are not allowed to teach in maintained schools (where you must have QTS), yet you still have QTS - Qualified Teacher Status - which they never take away from you.

    They just say that it is not enough!

    Best wishes

    .
     
    emmalcm1 likes this.
  13. emmalcm1

    emmalcm1 Established commenter

    oops bizarre not bazaar!
     
  14. TheoGriff

    TheoGriff Star commenter

  15. PizzoCalabro

    PizzoCalabro Established commenter

    I think the rules only apply to LA schools. Round here everywhere is an academy or a free school or an indie, so rules don't apply.
     
  16. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    Remember that you can always do the missing Induction term/s later on (even years later on). It's just that you can't take short term (under a term's length) qualified teaching once you 5 years from getting QTS and haven't completed Induction.

    Wales has different rules as they have devolved powers in the Welsh Parliament for Education and Health (no prescription charges in Wales). Those living just over the border could solve the supply rule issue by going into Wales to teach!

    The 5 year rule applies to those who gained QTS AFTER THE RULE CAME IN. (CAN'T REMEMBER WHEN IT CHANGED FROM A 19 MONTH RULE)
    The 16 month rule started on 7th May 1999. I finished my PGCE in June 1999 and was thus subject to it. Had I done the PGCE a year earlier as I had intended to, I wouldn't have been subject to any supply rule. I could have spent my entire career on supply with no Induction period either.

    For those like TheoGriff who gained QTS years and years ago, a formal Induction period as an NQT would not be required if taking up a first post in a school.
     

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