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Teaching children with ADHD

Discussion in 'Behaviour' started by madwoman, Aug 16, 2005.

  1. Dapple, someto=imes we need to look beyond the behaviour to the cause or we can miss something important.

    Some children with autism flap their hands.
    now we can either find the cause of the flapping or do behaviour therapy to try and TRAIN them to stop.
    The trouble with the latter is we could miss something important.
    I know of a child who was doing this because the only way he could see properly was when he flapped his hands at the side of his head.
    If we had just TRAINED him to stop this vision problem would have been missed, don't you agree?

  2. Here is something to think about regarding conditioning and behaviour.
    You can teach a dog not to eat food on a plate unless given the ok, but the dog will never starve itself to death regardless of what it's been conditioned to do.
  3. I am still confused by your comments dapple.

    ADHD is assessed in similar ways to Autism (if it is done properly). Ie, by the way of observation, assessment, interview etc etc. Very few would doubt the existence of ASD - why do you continue to doubt its existence?.. Because you choose to and because it presents as a 'behaviour' first. I guess it is easier for some to say that behaviour difficulty arises from poor parenting or is always learned. However, many thousands of parents / carers had documented huge differences in behaviour in thier baby, which later turned out to have an ASD / ADHD diagnosis, way before whatever they as a parent had done could have an influence of this kind. Ie, I know of many hundreds of cases where babys rarely slept at all, other than 20 minute cat-naps in a 24 hour period, or where, when weaning their child, the baby absolutley refused solids / certain tastes and textures (incidentally, some of those 'instincts' were so strong that I know of several cases where babys were severely underweight, with thier health threatened. Even those where parents had followed a strict dietry / behaviour program). There are huge amounts of evidence out there now that support the existence of ADHD - you have not mentioned the brain scans which, rarely done due to cost (isnt it always the way), show up huge differences in the ADHD brain. There are no blood tests that can prove ADHD just as there are none for ASD or Dyslexia diagnosis.

    You do not account for families where only one child in 3 or 4 from the same immediate family have ADHD and have been 'treated' in much the same way. This can be the first, last or middle child. Additonally, it affects any class / IQ.

    Everyone has behaviour differences - but not everyone have those behaviours causing them REAL life difficulties because it is so frequent / severe.

    I find it hugely frustrating when people have set about disproving something without reading ALL the evidence or hearing - actually listening to, ALL the views of those it effects.
  4. Some people only listen to what they want to. Others look at ALL options before they decide they can make an informed decision. Some, look at only one side before they form an opinion...
  5. I've noticed that about you religious types. You seem entirely motivated by belief, with perhaps a sprinkling of vested interest.

    ADHD is patent nonsense. That doesn't mean that the kids you are victimising don't have problems, perhaps even medical issues, but you are so wrapped up in your ideology as not to be overly concerned. You have your diagnoses and you have no need to think at all.

    Unfortunately, it's true of much mental health. Any number of popular religions abound. I've even seen a psychiatrist allowing the casting out of devils, (The priest and his cohorts seemed just as mad afterwards,) with no benefit at all for the patient.

    Progress needs an open mind. This topic seems to attract bigots.

  6. I've worked with autism, mostly adults. Care of them is variable with a great deal of misdiagnosis and misunderstanding.

  7. So Dapple, what would your advise be for hand flapping, or rocking?
  8. Sport please don't ask dapple that question in case he answers something like 'line them all up and shoot them' afterall isn't that what hitler did to those he considered 'mad'

    You are a very ignorant person. I do not victimise any child, as you suggest that all of us that care do,it is your narrow view that is so stifling.
    ADHD and Autism aren't conditions to be hidden away and scorned but instead a different way of living for our very special children. YES DID YOU HEAR THAT WORD - S P E C I A L - I consider myself blessed to have my son and am only too glad that it is I that can make a difference to his life. I embrace the challenges I and my family have to face with renewed vigor knowing that the alternative is to listen to your kind of drivel and be sucked in by it. NO THANKS
  9. madwoman

    madwoman New commenter

    well said Poppit!
  10. mindful wrote:
    > There is no conclusive evidence to show that this is genetically inherited.

    I'd suggest having a look at the result of the Australian sudies of twins:



    To steal shamelessly from http://www.myadhd.com/causesofadhd.html#heredity

    Heredity as a Cause of ADHD

    Heredity is the most common cause of ADHD. Most of our information about the heritability of ADHD comes from family studies, adoption studies, twin studies and molecular genetic research.

    Family Studies: If a trait has a genetic basis we would expect the rate of occurrence to be higher with the biological family members (e.g., brown-eyed people tend to have family members with brown eyes). Dr. Joseph Biederman (1990) and his colleagues at the Massachusetts General Hospital have studied families of children with ADHD. They have learned that ADHD runs in families. They found that over 25% of the first-degree relatives of the families of ADHD children also had ADHD, whereas this rate was only about 5% in each of the control groups. Therefore, if a child has ADHD there is a five-fold increase in the risk to other family members.

    Adoption Studies: If a trait is genetic, adopted children should resemble their biological relatives more closely than they do their adoptive relatives. Studies conducted by psychiatrist Dr. Dennis Cantwell compared adoptive children with hyperactivity to their adoptive and biological parents. Hyperactive children resembled their biological parents more than they did their adoptive parents with respect to hyperactivity.

    Twin Studies: Another way to determine if there is a genetic basis for a disorder is by studying large groups of identical and non-identical twins. Identical twins have the exact same genetic information while non-identical twins do not. Therefore, if a disorder is transmitted genetically, both identical twins should be affected in the same way and the concordance rate?the probability of them both being affected?should be higher than that found in non-identical twins. There have been several major twin studies in the past few years that provide strong evidence that ADHD is highly heritable. They have had remarkably consistent results in spite of the fact that they were done by different researchers in different parts of the world. In one such study, Dr. Florence Levy and her colleagues studied 1,938 families with twins and siblings in Australia. They found that ADHD has an exceptionally high heritability as compared to other behavioral disorders. They reported an 82 percent concordance rate for ADHD in identical twins as compared to a 38 percent concordance rate for ADHD in non-identical twins.

    Molecular Genetic Research: Twins studies support the hypothesis of the important contribution that genes play in causing ADHD, but these studies do not identify specific genes linked to the disorder. Genetic research in ADHD has taken off in the past five years. This research has focused on specific genes that may be involved in the transmission of ADHD. Dopamine genes have been the starting point for investigation. Two dopamine genes, DAT1 and DRD4 have been reported to be associated with ADHD by a number of scientists. Genetic studies revealed promising results, and we should look for more information about this soon.

  11. madwoman

    thanks for these useful links. I didn't know there was so much information available xx
  12. madwoman

    madwoman New commenter

    Your welcome!
    I have adhd too (as well as my son)..... my poor husband :)
  13. Madwoman, I do and my daughter and my Hub is OCD and tourettes - imagine living here LOL!!!!!!!!

    I always appreciate your posts - great minds and all that stuff... thanks
  14. madwoman

    madwoman New commenter

    aww Joogle my family seems almost normal now :)
  15. Dapple, it saddens me to see that there are still teachers out there like you with such close-minded views about ADHD :(

    It's ironically hard to educate the educators in this matter!
  16. SirHenry@RawlinsonEn

    SirHenry@RawlinsonEn Occasional commenter

  17. Hi,

    Being new to this board, I apologise for not reading all the backlog, but I am a tad confused why ADHD has attracted such vitriol? If someone wouldn't mind explaining what the difficulty (in as dispassionate/detached terms as possible) I would be most grateful!

  18. "Being new to this board, I apologise for not reading all the backlog, but I am a tad confused why ADHD has attracted such vitriol? If someone wouldn't mind explaining what the difficulty (in as dispassionate/detached terms as possible) I would be most grateful!"

    Me, too!
  19. Slightly off topic but....given that ADHD is clearly a real syndrome and bearing in mind that it has only been recognised recently what about all the older people who must have the illness? How many of them go to the doctor with ADD symptoms and are promptly prescribed anti-depressants? That would be the wrong drug btw.
  20. madwoman

    madwoman New commenter

    yes it's a worry, but most doctors are enlightened nowadays to adults with adhd, its far more common than you would think!

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