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Discussion in 'Scotland - education news' started by halfajack, Sep 13, 2012.

  1. OK - "vocation" - something I'm called upon to do. I'm fine with that. As long as it's something I'm called upon to do 35 hours a week.
    I really am not doing it 45 hours a week, you know, 35 hours paid, and all the rest "you're a tube and you don't get paid for it."
    Think "manual labour." You tell kids to note their hourly rate, multiply it by the number of hours they do it, and, hey presto - their pretax income.
    Teachers, however...
    Are you really happy giving it all up for free?
  2. I think that one of the early posts said it best: "We are our own worst enemies." I am envious of the manner in which firefighters and police stick together and project solidarity to the public when criticized. Give me a break! Humans are not perfect. There are bad eggs within the clergy, medicine, legal, construction professions/ trades etc. Attacking each other does not serve our cause. For the high-minded intellectuals who see it as a vocation: feel free to do so, just don't judge the rest of us. For the regular folks who see it as a type of job to clock into day in and day out: please forgive those of us who like intellectual stimulation and think that we are making a difference on this planet. Can't we all just get along?
    BTW why did the original poster choose "aclockworkorange" as a screen name? I thought that it was a clever little novel at the time. However, I feel that Anthony Burgess wrote many more significant works. I can't help but wonder if that silly movie version ruined the impact of the novel for me. The theme of this novel seems to conflict with the thread that you initiated.
  3. Is there not an obvious opposition between the two? Can they get along?
    Can't you be a mixture of both?
    Firefighters and police dont all agree do they? Perhaps this is a thorny issue given Hillsborough or maybe it is a lesson to be learned about accepting viewpoints you disagree with.
    More communion wine needed...[​IMG]
  4. I'm sure there are bad eggs everywhere - but my own take on this thread is that it's OK to see teaching as a vocation. I spent half a lifetime in industry, and when (at an advanced age) my partner and I had kids, my experience as parent helper/school board member convinced me that this job was the one for me.
    I love being a teacher - I do see it as a vocation - but I don't see it as a sodding charity.
    I'm not going to do it for nothing, I need to eat. Why are so many of my colleagues doing so many hours a week for free?
    And on the subject of the OP's screen name - I have a horrid sensation that little Alex and his droogs are (all too often) what our overstressed and underfunded profession are producing nowadays.
    Call me a malenky bit poogly if you like, but "aclockworkorange" is the very slovo for these disturbing days.
  5. jonowen

    jonowen Occasional commenter

    please can you send some up here please St. jo [​IMG]
  6. kibosh

    kibosh Star commenter

    Don't know what you mean, I suspect we are talking at cross purposes.
    I meant the kind of stuff life should already be full of, so that when you leave the profession it's all there waiting for you, the only difference being you have a lot more time to pursue it all. Then you don't need to use your imagination; why imagine what you already do and have?
    The difficulty lies with folk retiring who have never had a wide range of interests outside of work. What will they imagine if their starting point is a blank canvas. It's much easier to build on some kind of existing framework (however skeletal) when you come to create a new life for yourself.
  7. kibosh

    kibosh Star commenter

  8. Anonymous

    Anonymous New commenter

    kibosh...I was agreeing with you but being tongue in cheek. Obviously that didn't come across.
  9. I got it.
  10. "I love being a teacher - I do see it as a vocation - but I don't see it as a sodding charity."
    I'll agree heartily w/ that. I worked half a lifetime in the private sector myself. Some days I can't believe that I am getting paid for doing something I love. Although, some days are very difficult and I don't think that my compensation is sufficient.
    "And on the subject of the OP's screen name - I have a horrid sensation that little Alex and his droogs are (all too often) what our overstressed and underfunded profession are producing nowadays."
    I don't think that we should blame ourselves. Society is more complex than that... parents, adminstrators, television; there is plenty of blame to go around. I do hope, though, that we can help turn around Alex and some of his droogs to the right path. We can at least try and hope for the best outcome.
    "Call me a malenky bit poogly if you like, but "aclockworkorange" is the very slovo for these disturbing days."
    What a terrifically 'horrorshow" comment! [​IMG](That was my favorite word from the book. I've used it w/ Russians that I meet. It is roughly pronounced : [hurushaa].)
  11. Teachers in Scotland get eleven days more than other council workers who have worked for five years upwards. See my post in 'Work in Scotland' for a breakdown of days.
  12. kibosh

    kibosh Star commenter

    Sorry, I've been having a sense of humour bypass lately [​IMG]
  13. I so agree with you. Of course we can't tar everyone with the same brush but I have experienced an element of arrogance with many teachers. I worked in both commercial and public sector jobs before teaching and really believed I was moving into a more altruistic sphere. It shocked me how little care and teamwork there is in what can be a very demanding profession. I have seen a lot of teachers who behave like playground bullies and would not get away with their behaviour in other workplaces. I do believe that you should have experience of the 'real world' before entering teaching. My experience of alternative work was of great interest to my students. I have recently had to take office work due to lack of teaching posts in my area and it is a sobering experience to be paid £7 per hour to be bored stiff in front of computer screen all day. I missed the pressure and the £23 an hour I was lucky enough to be paid for it!
  14. I've been teaching for 17 years and before that worked in retail and the care industry. Teaching for me is a job, not a lifestyle or vocation. It is a means to get money. Working with children gets very frustrating and even more so when it is hampered by unrealistic demands, and so we moan! It's away of coping, especially when idealistic people start saying it's a vocation as though we should put up and shut up. The job is not a charity either and when someone says 'we're in this for the children' or 'school is a place for children not adults' it makes me sick. Sure I get in a negative rut sometimes, but I've always been professional and think I'm more down to earth and in touch with reality than those who spout the word vocation and destiny like they've had a calling from God. I've had to sit in staff meetings listening to such people and how they have to decide how many wrappings should go on pass the parcel for the Christmas party so everyone is the same. Believe me, I've spent most of my job feeling less than comfortable and clever, but hey, I get paid at the end of every month!
  15. Effinbankers

    Effinbankers Lead commenter

    Is teaching and education not part of the "real world"? Wiithour our inputs into the education of children there would be no potential employees for other sectors of the economy. Let's not forget this - we perform an essential role in the "real world".
    I'm getting fed up with people who say you have to have this or that to be a good classroom practitioner. Or that you need to must see it as a vocation.
    It doesn't matter what colour, creed, age or experience you have before you step into a classroom. Nor does it matter if you see it as a means of paying your mortagage or as a forty year vocation. As long as you are capable of doing the job that's fine with me. Everyone has different strengths and I would hate to think teachers have to conform to some uniform stereotype before being permitted to teach.
    Being good at driving trains does not make you a good surgeon. Prior experience can be helpful, but not always - I've seen some dreadful students and teachers who have changed careers and gone (wrongly) into teaching.

  16. People who say teaching is not part of the real world have clearly never had the bottom third-years last period on a Friday.
  17. kibosh

    kibosh Star commenter

  18. Please don't generalise, before training to become an F.E. lecturer, I spent half my working life in the building trade. I know about reality alright. I then became a supply teacher in the secondary sector, worked in lots of rough schools, I'm now unemployed!

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