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Teachers being targeted for dismissal or capibility

Discussion in 'Workplace dilemmas' started by carrotsandcream, May 2, 2012.

  1. carrotsandcream

    carrotsandcream New commenter

    Is there any data showing which teachers are being targeted for capability or dismissal (perhaps from the unions) Is there discrimination going on?
  2. carrotsandcream

    carrotsandcream New commenter

    Is there any data showing which teachers are being targeted for capability or dismissal (perhaps from the unions) Is there discrimination going on?
  3. You are unlikely to get details about teachers who are, or were, subjected to capability procedures.
    The best you could probably get would be to identify which schools have a reputation for launching a high number of capability procedures against its staff.
    For example, regional teaching union officials will know which are the high risk schools and should give such information to inquiring members.
    Also general information can also be obtained by submitting a freedom of information request to particular schools/local authorities about numbers of capability procedures initated. Precise case details will be redacted to preserve the indentity of the teacher, but an FOI request should give a steer whether the school relies on capability procedures alot.
    But this on its own does not indicate discrimination. That information is revealed during legal proceedings maybe ET.
    A third poss option might be to identify an academic who has done some research in capabiity procedures and
    so can identify some defining characteristics of the "typical" manager and
    "typical" teacher involved. This would be an excellent research project. I have a rough idea of what the conclusions might be, but that would be based on antecdotal evidence I would try the Institute of Education.
    Why do you ask?

  4. carrotsandcream

    carrotsandcream New commenter

    The reason why I have asked this question is that a friend who works in an inner city school told me that at a recent nuion meeting. staff were told that research shows that a high number of teachers in their early 50s are suddenly being told that they are not good teachers. Some of this is happening via lesson observations which are now being deemed as unsatisfactory. Some of these teachers are then being offered a 2nd lesson observation, which is also deemed as satisfactory. The said teachers then go off sick or may opt to leave the school. Some of the teachers call the union in and are offered a package.
    I was wandering if there was a pattern emerging and if anyone else had noticed this trend. Can anyone else add some light to this. Reading between the lines in the Forums I think that this might be happening
  5. AlwaysAdaptable

    AlwaysAdaptable New commenter

    And ofcourse some of these teachers in their 50s will be UPS2 or 3. I know a few this is happening to. Unfortunately some of these 50 year olds have children, mortgages and expenses just like the younger teachers. It is hard to find jobs when one is over 50. This practice has to stop and the unions need to fight it. The equalities act is just a lip service.

  6. rosievoice

    rosievoice Star commenter

    Are you implying that, in a fair and caring profession such as education, some heads, perhaps looking at their budgets, and, instead of valuing their experience, actively drive out old and expensive teachers? Surely not!
    It's much more logical to assume that such older staff suddenly and dramatically become ineffective practitioners and must, regrettably, be replaced.
    Evil people.
  7. Yeah, but that could be antecdotal evidence, or more the scientific research. If the latter, then that would be very interesting and not before time.
    If your friend doesn't know the precise source of the research, then it would be helpful if you perhaps could just identify the union concerned.
    Yes, I suspect there is likely to be a pattern. I suspect some HT victimise older staff for the budgetary reasons given, but suspect that in many more cases this explanation disguises the real motive becasue many schools have enormous cash reserves. No the more common reason I suspect is because too many HTs (usually those promoted above their ability) simply want younger staff because they are more compliant, less questioning and easier to intimidate.
  8. timed out:
    If true, the current trends would suggest that teachers should perhaps expect a career span of 20 years maximum.
    Can't see how the average teacher can still be expected to teach until 168 years, as the govt wants..
  9. chriszwinter1

    chriszwinter1 New commenter

    No, surely not? What a terrible accusation!! You'll be suggesting next that those HTs who have been promoted above their ability are insecure numbskulls whose paranoia is such that they know that older teachers have seen every brand spanking new initiative a dozen times before and know that it's all smoke and mirrors.
  10. Compassman

    Compassman Star commenter

    I think it is getting more and more common. Maybe not through capability procedures but through excessive pressure.
    Well you have a teacher in their early to mid 50s they are on UPS 3 and maybe a TLR and suddenly they find themselves inadequate. Up until then there have been no issues with their teaching. They are then given loads of extra work to do and if they complain then they are not being supportive of the children. The teachers are set unrealistically high targets (after all the the FFT data is gospel isn't it??!) and because the teacher feels bad they either stop down / go part time / resign / retire. After all why pay for a 55 year old when you can have two compliant 22 year olds in their place?
    It stinks!
  11. Thanks for this- Could you find out more about this research and refer us to it -cheers
  12. greygaunt

    greygaunt New commenter

    There may (and I have only anecdotal evidence to support this) an assumption that if one is any 'good' as a teacher one will be at the very least an assistant head/head of faculty by ones late 40's/early 50's. Those who have not are thus automatically looked at askance.
  13. AlwaysAdaptable

    AlwaysAdaptable New commenter

    Not everyone wants to be part of the SLT. Some teachers want to teach and make a difference. Most older teachers I know have a lot more responsibilites than less experienced teachers anyway and yet these are the teachers targeted. Its all political.
  14. rosievoice

    rosievoice Star commenter

    I have encountered this ridiculous assumption.

    Due to the pyramid-shaped structure of management in schools, it is impossible for every teacher to become a head.
  15. Exactly what seems to be happening in my school. Suddenly incompetent after ten years. One year of slightly poorer results and a few months later formal capability. Every "official" observation barely satisfactory or worse, changing targets impossible to meet yet glowing feedback from students and parents for years. It doesn't add up. Oh, forgot to mention also UPS and approaching 50s...Perhaps also been a little too outspoken about thenvalidity of new initiatives. Young, inexperienced and pliable teachers promoted while older and wiser colleagues passed over. This is an absolute tragedy for our young people who will be the ultimate victims of this increasingly widespread cull of wise and experienced adults who are being forced out of teaching. The trouble is, we all know what is happening but it is so difficult to prove because it seems all a school needs is the "evidence" of judgements made on lessons according to ridiculously subjective criteria. And if people want to leave with even a shred of dignity there seems little option but to sign a CA and then go quietly.
  16. Its happening to mums too. Im an older mum, UPS2 and outspoken when I disagree with something. The school I left was working everyone to death. Staff morale was low, everyone was moaning. However, people would not stick together. It was a classic divide and conquer style of management. Id never had a bad lesson observation in 15years but received two barely satisfactory lessons observations. Granted the new ofsted lesson observation format was being followed. I must have been a failing teacher for the whole of my career then? One problem with that theory, all my pupils made good progress every year. I was told off because I hadnt fully embraced a literacy initiative which has subsequently been significantly adapted. People are scared to speak up and air their views because they can see where it ends up. The school is struggling now with less experienced teachers as they are having to invest time in training them. It is the pupils who will suffer. Something needs to be done about this. As to what Im unsure. I do no ageism is not restricted to the world of education.
  17. AlwaysAdaptable

    AlwaysAdaptable New commenter

    My point too. Something needs to be done but what I am not sure. What really gets me is that the decision makers in school target older UPS teachers knowing that some these teachers could be the main bread winners bringing up a young family. How can someone become inadequate in a year. I've known of cases where a teacher after being graded outstanded 3 times last year, suddenly became inadequate. Its going to go all 'belly up'.
  18. When redundancy bestrode my school, like a colostomy, all of us who went were on the upper pay spine and all but one over 50. Like many teachers, I have never sought promotion of any sort, as I did not want to manage, just to teach.
  19. This is just more anecdotal evidence, I know, but recently I've been getting contacted more by older members of staff nearing retirement for advice. Previously I mostly got PGCE students and NQTs asking for help.
  20. Compassman

    Compassman Star commenter

    A new one is being told about the new September 2012 imposed standards and the emphasis on those 'experienced' teachers needing to do more to reach the standards. Another excuse to bully older staff. My school are losing over 15 staff this summer due to the fact that they've had enough. Some good teachers as well. The school will soon be left with teachers who have only up to 5 -10 years experience but are willing to tow the line. Quite depressing really.

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