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Teacher pensions: How do you feel about the changes?

Discussion in 'Education news' started by TES_Rosaline, May 3, 2019.

  1. TES_Rosaline

    TES_Rosaline Administrator Staff Member

    Are you jumping for joy about your teacher pension, do you think you are worse off because of the changes or is there no reason to celebrate? Well, one minister believes that state-school teachers are ungrateful for their pensions?

    ‘Schools minister Lord Agnew has suggested that state-school teachers are ungrateful about changes to their pensions that have left schools worrying about their funding.

    Speaking to a conference of independent-school leaders today, Lord Agnew said: “The state-school teachers, they don’t recognise that they’re getting a 42 per cent increase in pensions contributions.

    “They don’t say, ‘How wonderful – the state is really looking after us’.”

    But a union leader has pointed out that teachers will not actually receive any extra money and accused the minister of putting his foot in his mouth.’

    What do you think?

    https://www.tes.com/news/minister-suggests-state-school-teachers-are-ungrateful-their-pensions
     
  2. Sundaytrekker

    Sundaytrekker Star commenter

    The union leader is correct. The increased contribution isn’t adding anything extra for teachers it is just balancing the books and keeping the scheme going. For now.
     
  3. Lalad

    Lalad Star commenter

    Wasn't it Lord Agnew who last year defended the £440k salary of an academy CEO as 'reasonable'? Most teachers are on a fraction of that sum and have seen their salaries plummet in value over recent years - what exactly are we supposed to be grateful for?
     
  4. diddydave

    diddydave Occasional commenter

    Smoke and mirrors.

    'Contributions' that were never paid directly from school budgets in the past are now being given to schools and then taken back again. This means:

    1) That school's will 'appear' to be getting *much* more money (at least a 6% increase from September) - you can hear the ministerial sound-bites already...
    2) Schools already struggling to pay for good teachers will have an even harder time
    3) Teacher pay has already been devolved to schools/academies - the incentive for it to be eroded gets greater
     
  5. Jamvic

    Jamvic Senior commenter

    fgs, stop your complaining all you peasants teachers, just doff your caps or tug your forelocks at the Lord, be suitably subservient and act like you don’t really understand all this complex financial stuff. What is the world coming to!
     
    tonymars, Mrsmumbles and agathamorse like this.
  6. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    It's a transfer of liabilities from the state to schools.
     
  7. caterpillartobutterfly

    caterpillartobutterfly Star commenter

    Because of the changes, many private schools are pulling out and giving their teachers a totally naff pension as an alternative.
    This will mean even less money going in to the TPS and so even more changes to come.

    Thin end of the wedge so far.
     
  8. Mrsmumbles

    Mrsmumbles Star commenter

    Would those be the overpaid CEOS who are also entitled to be in TPS? What a lovely little chap Aggie is....
     
    agathamorse likes this.
  9. Mrsmumbles

    Mrsmumbles Star commenter

    Several good indies near me are struggling to recruit now, partly because of this. I see the same jobs readvertised. One girl I tutor attends the school and they are losing a fair whack of usual lessons for those interview lessons which oddly never seem to lead to anyone getting hired..maybe the canddiates have read the small print and gone elsewhere.
     
    Jamvic, simonCOAL and agathamorse like this.
  10. simonCOAL

    simonCOAL Occasional commenter

    Interesting.
    Also, your point about CEOs being eligible for TPS is a good one. Anyone know the answer?
     
  11. ridleyrumpus

    ridleyrumpus Lead commenter

    Not really as TPS is unfunded.

    There is no pension pot* where your "contributions' go to.

    Rather we are just paid X% less than we think with a promise that some more will be found should we make it to a pensionable age.

    It's a pyramid scheme that would be illegal if carried out by anyone else but the government.

    *there is no spoon.
     
  12. caterpillartobutterfly

    caterpillartobutterfly Star commenter

    I am aware of how the TPS works.
    However what we are paying in supports those already drawing their pension. With less going in from all the indies pulling out, there will be even less available for those retiring in the next few years.
    Therefore the government or state schools will need to prop up the system.
     
    Jamvic likes this.
  13. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    What I am afraid of is that this is part of a scheme to heighten awareness of the expense of teacher pensions, leading to a move in a few years time to change the notion of pensions so that teachers end up with the same money purchase options that most other people have, that aren't very good because nobody can afford to pay much into them. This is why the right wing press every so often run exaggerated stories about gold plated public sector pensions to make the rest of the population jealous.
    Whan I started teaching, the government expected to pay for schools, including the deferred pay we know as pensions. The grand trick of academisation was to move the costs away from government, this was obvious costs like staff salaries, buildings and the like, but now includes rates, pensions, interest payments on the PFI deals of the last couple of decades.
    We have a "small state" government. This is one of the things that small state means.
     
    Jamvic and Mrsmumbles like this.
  14. Mrsmumbles

    Mrsmumbles Star commenter

    I always just assumed that those overpaid heads of academy trusts qualified for teacher pensions. The whole system is now unfair, ageist and nepotistic.
     
    schoolsout4summer likes this.
  15. Mrsmumbles

    Mrsmumbles Star commenter

    Altering tps to make us pay in more to get less back is essentially the final nail in an already splintered coffin. Sadly.
     
    Jamvic likes this.
  16. Happygopolitely

    Happygopolitely Occasional commenter

    Mps have a better pay and pension. And nurses get to carry on with the old pension scheme if they started off in it.

    Teachers pay anyway is less per hr than nurses and the police. Teachers also have no Overtime pay. Nurses and the police of course have better pensions too.
     
    Mrsmumbles and schoolsout4summer like this.
  17. applecrumblebumble

    applecrumblebumble Lead commenter

    I’m going to sound selfish but I have said that things are still not bad enough for teachers to take action to defend a good pension system. I think we are seeing nails in coffin with the independent sector but there will be cost. The independent sector will have to pay higher salaries to recruit/retain staff because some staff will leave to go to the state sector. The younger recruits will have the choice of other graduate professions which offer better career progression and probably better entry salaries so in the end more competition.
    I cannot see how the state sector academies will not be affected by the changes taking place in the independent sector with even more employer contribution expected and probably employee contributions, all because the government do not want these salary related pensions.
    I going to add to the selfishness by saying I am expecting to continue receiving my pension by those teachers working today as I paid into the system for those who retired before me. If that is not going to happen in the future then it is in the hands of the current generation of teachers to do something.
     
    Mrsmumbles likes this.
  18. Sundaytrekker

    Sundaytrekker Star commenter

    CEOs shouldn’t be in TPS. To be in TPS you have to be in a teaching role up to and including headteacher. If you do not have headteacher responsibilities: Ofsted named person, person able to exclude pupils and suspend staff etc then it should be a different type of contract. I know someone moved from headship to CEO of a small MAT. He went onto Soulbury Scale as used by LAs with a different pension scheme.
     
    Mrsmumbles likes this.
  19. ridleyrumpus

    ridleyrumpus Lead commenter

    The government already props up the system.

    It can only get worse as the population ages, how countries with negative population growth are going to cope is quite worrying. Isn't Italy at 1.1 children per couple, disastrous for an economy.

    Other countries in a similar position are instigating alternative plans, when I was in Russia a decade or so ago some towns were instigating one day holidays so that you could spend the day doing your best to increase the population. Perhaps they call them Bonk Holidays.
     
    Mrsmumbles likes this.
  20. Mrsmumbles

    Mrsmumbles Star commenter

    That is slightly more reassuring, but even a faculty head or whatever they pretentiously call themseves now at academies would be on a far higher whack than most of us...managing all those acadmies..imagine what they would get at retirement if they ate in over £250k per annum now. The discrepancies are what annoy me the most. They are just not worth it.
     

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