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So, no ict at all in the EBac?

Discussion in 'Computing and ICT' started by mossonbrick, Feb 10, 2011.

  1. tonyuk

    tonyuk Occasional commenter

    Though I hate the whole office thing I would also add how many kids can actually layout a letter properly using a wordprocessor (or how many teachers for that matter) or know what a memo, minutes etc are okay they are not ICT in the strictest sense but teachers letting kids use wordart in reports and letters, comic sans etc AMAZING
    I can not wait to see the backlash from business when kids come out and cant do the basics (but then its not a problem as we all seem to becoming grammar schools with our curriculum - now if only Mr Gove modelled schools on his experience....oh he has!!)
  2. I would explain to you the difference between content and delivery, but honestly...I can't be *****!
  3. Sorry Mark, nothing personal, but kids
    are voting with their feet and dropping IT courses. The kids that do
    take KS5 IT courses tend to be weak students with limited options.
    Too many kids think Computer Science at University is all about MS
    Office because of their school experience of ICT. The resultant annual
    decline in the numbers choosing IT courses at University is something
    “Captains of Industry” take very seriously; a fact widely and
    regularly reported in the press.
  4. OK Vimes (sorry I don't know your name), let me try and explain why I so strongly disagree with you.
    Some kids may be voting with their feet but not all. I should perhaps begin by saying that I teach in an all boys comprehensive school up to year 11 with a combined co-ed sixth form. In my school we really push our students. By the time they get to the end of year 8 they have already covered all of the office applications, to the level I indicated in my previous post. We do not teach these skills out of context. Our year 7 program this year is all about entering a Formula One rasing team. The students are writing letters to prospective sponsors, creating posters, making presentations etc. The spreadsheet module is worked in with a maths mroject whereby they need to design the best F1 car for a particular track, taking into account the sharpness of the bends, lengths of the straights, fuel levels etc. They have also created programs using Scratch and progressed to reasonably advanced graphics editing.
    In year 9 the vast majority of the students complete a BTEC extended Certificate in ICT. (We get 4 1 hour lessons per week for the year 9 students). Our pass rate is extremley high and all of the pupils really enjoy the course. The optional modules we do are Computer Graphics and Spreadsheet Design. This year we are inviting a couple of designers in from a local web design company to talk to the boys to put this learning into a real world context.
    In years 10 and 11 the ICT BTEC Diploma (L2) is an option. Indications are we will have more than 40 students choosing ICT as their option in KS4. They are defintely not weak. They are dedicated, committed students with a passion for ICT. Next year the two optional modules for year 10 will be Installing Software and Multimedia Design.
    In the 6th form we run both A level and Level 3 BTEC. The level 3 BTEC is the more popular course.
    Throughout their time with us the students are encouraged to work at their own pace. We never hold them back. We currently have three year 9 boys starting the year 10 course now as they have forged ahead with the certificate course. We have one year 10 student sitting in with the sixth formers working his way through the ICT A level.
    We see not being part of the EBac as an opportunity. We were particulary worried that GSCE ICT might be part of it. Then we would have to move over to that more academic, but in my opinion less engaging qualification. Thank goodness that's not the case!
  5. And I know I spelled racing as rasing, but there is no edit option on this forum!
  6. Do outline your problem, or just make a comment with no actual content. This approach seems to be a feature of your posts.
  8. Snore...

    Dealing with you is like dealing with that Y9 kid who discovered a hair on his top lip in the morning and now thinks he has a right to be heard no matter how much **** he talks.

    Really, really dull.
  9. I am not a regular contributor to these forums but I do pop in occasionally. Every time I do pop in I come across threads where John Brown makes sarcastic, rude, personal, sometimes spiteful comments about people. I have never come across a useful constructive comment made by this individual. I suspect many people are put off commenting as a result of JB's rants, which is a shame. I suspect he is a very unhappy, lonely and bitter individual who is need of help.
    Sorry my own contribution isn't a little more constructive.
  10. These are the facts. 50% reduction in applications to “Computing” courses since 2001.
    ICT A-level; numbers down by 34% since 2003. Computing A-level; numbers down 34% since 2003. This at a time when the IT sector employs 1.5 million people.

    Quote from the QCDA report on ICT from 2009:

    “Statistically valid research amongst over 1,000 students by e-skills UK showed the ICT GCSE as being the single biggest factor in the decline of uptake of IT-related A-levels and degrees. Students typically considered the curriculum at Key Stage 4 to be boring, focused on the use of office applications (word, excel, powerpoint) and poorly taught. As a result, they overwhelmingly saw future study or careers in IT as dull and repetitive. They also held (incorrect) perceptions about low pay and lack of job opportunity.”

    Individual schools/teachers may buck the trend, but lots of people outside teaching see the school ICT curriculum as a problem damaging the economy. Hence it's no surprise to me ICT is not a viable option for the EBacc. I say all this as an ICT teacher facing the same employment uncertainly as everyone else.

    I don't teach BTEC ICT, but our school does offer BTEC PE, a course which so far nobody has failed. While I like some of the units on offer via BTEC I think the mode of assessment makes it too easy for students to pass, a fact recognized by universities leading to discrimination against it. My Form are currently making their GCSE options. I have no problem guiding some students towards BTEC but its important to me that able students are able to take options allowing them to compete on a level playing field with grammar school kids when applying to leading universities. In my opinion, the best option available from the “ICT subjects” is A-level Computing, taken with maths. At KS4 I'd echo the sentiments of the QCDA report and say students experience of ICT makes it a battle to inform them what an “IT pro” rather than “IT user” qualification is all about (your curriculum may be better than ours). I don't think the QCDA report is available on line any more, but if you'd like a copy I'll email it to you if you PM me.
  11. Is calling someone a 'mymouse' in this forum an insult? What's a mymouse and why is that not good?
  12. Old poster who spouted ****. Google is your friend: http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q="mymouse"#hl=en&safe=off&q=+site:community.tes.co.uk+"mymouse"+tes
  13. I've just done a search for johnbrown as well as mymouse. He appears to be as obnoxious and as odeous to the vast majority of posters here (and I would presume his colleagues) as the mymouse character. If someone calls me a "mymouse", is calling them a "johnbrown" a bigger insult?
  14. Thought it was you.
    Showing your cards again, MM.
    Little bit more subtlety next time, eh?
  15. Oh dear.
    Oh deary deary dear.
    You really are strange, you johnbrown, you. (It sounds like you are calling someone a stool when you use that insult).
  16. As an IT Consultant, I have to agree. In my experience as KS3 Co-ordinator, ICT has always had to fight for curriculum time from less enlightened school managers. Recent trends at KS4 have been towards Business and ICT courses, together with a relentless drive to poorly thought out Functional Skills courses.

    Britain in the 21st Century needs to prepare students for a global e-conomy, collaborative working and problem solving skills. There seems to be a genuine crossroads between Future technology skills and MS Office skills. One of the few things we make in this country and compete globally in, is software development. Games programming, small companies with niche bespoke markets etc. India is an IT Powerhouse and China is fast catching up.

    I am part of a group trying to promote Computing at Schools (CAS), the problem solving skills have genuine academic validity that even Mr Gove could not argue with. Universities are crying out for students with Computing skills and guess which industry will have the greatest demand for young people as we come out of the recession? Computing Science degrees have very high rates of graduate employment, (I work with UWE; check the stats). However, general IT degrees have poor rates of employment. Employers are looking for graduates with technical problem solving skills, in Linux, Android, programming and scripting in various languages, not skills which could be learnt from a teach yourself CD in a day.

    This is not just my opinion, but also that of the many Universities and employers that I am in contact with.
  17. Sad,arrogant git.
  18. Totally concur. This used to be a place where you could share and learn useful information. Now, it is just a bunch of posters going on about 'mymouse' and making accusations about trolling and socks. I am not sure if it is an orchestrated attempt to destroy a forum, but I rarely come here to read or post anymore because of a few tedious posters.
  19. I don't think us ICT teachers are actually disputing that "Office Studies" (ECDL, old OCR) is easy to get through or something that couldn't be done in a term or so. What we're unhappy with is that ICT is much more than this, should be more than this and we need to raise the bar for how ICT is taught, assessed and qualified by exam boards...
  20. I've never had an ICT lesson in my life either, yet I have somehow managed to gain the skills necessary to teach ICT to A2 standard. My colleagues who do not teach ICT are perfectly comfortable using Word and Excel and many are capable of running basic queries and producing reports from an unwieldy database such as SIMS. How many of us have had to learn to use programs such as Dreamweaver or Flash with no training? ICT skills are easy to acquire and we have to stop being so arrogant as a group of professionals, believing we are the gatekeepers of all technical knowledge.
    I don't think I could have held my head up high in the staffroom if ICT had been included in the ebac. To suggest any of the current ICT courses are as academically worthwhile as the likes of GCSE Maths or French would be an insult to those subjects. Our subject is easy to teach and easy to achieve in, and you only have to look at your department's results for proof.
    If we want, as a group of teachers, for our efforts to be taken seriously, then maybe we should stop selecting courses that boost school results and instead pick courses that offer a genuine challange to our students and allow the truelly able to outshine the rest.

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