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Should Year 3's sit Year 6 Numeracy SAT's?

Discussion in 'Primary' started by cookie10, Feb 6, 2011.

  1. We've been told that SAT optional papers, for Numeracy, have been incorrectly levelling students.
    The proposal is that all students from Year 3, and up, (who are achieving 2a in Level 1 & 2 paper) will sit the Year 6 Numeracy paper for Levels 3-5.
    Have you encountered this anamoly? How is your school dealing with this?
     
  2. We've been told that SAT optional papers, for Numeracy, have been incorrectly levelling students.
    The proposal is that all students from Year 3, and up, (who are achieving 2a in Level 1 & 2 paper) will sit the Year 6 Numeracy paper for Levels 3-5.
    Have you encountered this anamoly? How is your school dealing with this?
     
  3. Anonymous

    Anonymous New commenter

    That will be interesting - I have no doubts that some children will get some of the questions but will find many of them really hard. So what's the point?
    Decent assessment should identify who can do what and the level they are working at.
    So glad I left.

     
  4. lillipad

    lillipad New commenter

    Can't understand that, as it will surely be requiring objectives and methods the chn haven't been introduced to yet in year 3!
     
  5. lardylegs

    lardylegs Occasional commenter

    OK, they might be able to do the straightforward calculations, but how can they be tested on concepts they've not yet been taught? They will just leave half the questions unanswered, surely?
     
  6. tafkam

    tafkam Occasional commenter

    Also, in most cases students with a reading age of 9 or below would be able to get a reader for the SATs because of the literacy challenges. Does your school propose having a reader for every individual in Years 3 and 4?
     


  7. Lillipad, I have the same confusion.
    I've been told that a Year 6 Level 3 student should be the same level as a Year 3 level 3 student, and as such both should be able to sit the same paper.
    My concern is that we are assessing children on what they can't do.

    Even though there may be a question or two in the paper that my more able students could answer, if it is not in the first few questions, they will be demotivated by that point and may fail to answer it/them!
     
  8. minnieminx

    minnieminx New commenter

    I would tell the children you know are working at level 3 to concentrate on the first 10 questions and leave the rest as they are for the older children. They should be able to access those questions and, if working at level 3, answer them and get them correct. Remember KS2 SATs do start with the level 3 questions and then the level 4 and then the level 5. So your level 3 children will be able to find things they can do early on which will give them confidence.

    A level 3 child in year 3 should be able to do more or less the same as a level 3 child in year 6. If you are teaching children concepts in line with the current level, then there will be nothing a level 3 in year 6 can do that a level 3 in year 3 can't.

    Having said all of that, giving much younger children KS2 SATs isn't how I would tackle the problem at all. I would, and given a choice do, give KS2 papers to years 5 and 6, but lower than that and their reading age becomes an issue.
     
  9. How does your school ensure that Numeracy levels are accurate and consistent across year groups and Key Stages?
    Is anyone aware of any commercial assessment products that give can be trusted to give accurate levels, year on year?
     
  10. We have been told that we will use one paper this week, to take a half yearly level. At this point, the students will only sit one paper and therefore the mark will be multiplied by 2.5 to give a mark out of 100. Is this a fair analysis of what a student is capable of achieving?
     
  11. tafkam

    tafkam Occasional commenter

    Definitely not. There is an interesting discussion on the maths forum at the moment looking at the correlation between success on Paper 1 and Paper 2 and overall score, and the relationship is far more complex than just doubling and adding half again! After all, if you could work it out this way, then why bother doing two papers at all?
    It strikes me that whoever is suggesting this is wholly incompetent in their understanding of test assessment - if only be naively thinking that one type of test from a batch is any more reliable than any other.
    Has your school considered asking the professional teaching staff to assess children's understanding and to assign a level accordingly? That might work!
     
  12. minnieminx

    minnieminx New commenter

    Total disaster to use one paper and multiply by 2.5.

    Not all topics will be covered. Mental arithmetic not assessed at all. Will give a level even less accurate than optional year tests.

    Your school could use test base to put together a level test. Then using the APP judgements teachers decide what level test to put the children in for. Not ideal, but better than the current proposals.

    The optional SATs aren't great, but are the best about.
     
  13. forestje

    forestje New commenter

    By using the CGP Assessment Papers termly.
     

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