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Should renumeration include family health insurance?

Discussion in 'Teaching abroad' started by 4penguin14, Feb 11, 2020.

  1. kemevez

    kemevez Occasional commenter

    I’ll never forget the time I was told what my “compensation” would be if I accepted a particular job.
     
  2. percy topliss

    percy topliss Established commenter

    Oddly enough most policies do not involve taking things out. Babies and teeth are not often included!

    Perce
     
  3. dumbbells66

    dumbbells66 Lead commenter

    i have found maternity cover very common, but the level to which it "covers" can vary massively.
     
  4. kemevez

    kemevez Occasional commenter

    Yep this is a sign of the times. Most, but not all, of the better schools no longer offer dental insurance. Same goes for medical insurance in general though - even expats who earn 10 times what teachers do are losing out in that respect (a dental component). Nice perk but not a deal breaker.
     
  5. Mainwaring

    Mainwaring Lead commenter

    I've seen that usage before. Possibly American?
     
  6. cactusqueen

    cactusqueen New commenter

    I am afraid this is not a good package, but now a days a pretty standard package. You will struggle to have any sort of life on only 1300 per month as a family, unless your husband is working too. There is a very high chance that you will be only housed in a 2 bed apartment as well. It is quite standard now that schools only pay for the person they are employing and do not offer family packages any longer as there are so many young, single and naive UK and Irish teachers heading out here, that the schools don't need to attract families. You will be looking at £1000 each for health insurance, £500 each for Visa's and at least £2500 as a family to fly home each holiday. So basically only budget for earning 10 months salary a year as the rest has gone before you start.
     
    BlueHues likes this.
  7. february31st

    february31st Established commenter

    I feel with the hundreds of teachers leaving China this year and nobody rushing in to take up employment, remuneration packages are set to decline elsewhere in the world.

    To many teachers chasing to few jobs causing the standard supply and demand issues.

    But at least teachers and their families in China should be due a substantial health insurance upgrade.
     
  8. IndigoViolence

    IndigoViolence New commenter

    I turned down a shiny stone owned school for exactly that reason. Salary too low to live on with 4 and having to pay medical for 2 and flights for three negate the idea of it being a good school. As much as I love Dubai and the UAE - some things are non negotiable- free places for children, flights and medical for whole family.
     
  9. frogusmaximus

    frogusmaximus Occasional commenter

    I think this thread is a little silly tbh.

    If schools were required to offer health insurance to all family members, they would simply employ single people to avoid additional costs.

    Never understood why i was given 500 dollars a month housing allowance tbh on top of a generous salary. Did i get housing allowance in the UK? Sure, offer me accommodation as part of my package if i'm in an expensive housing area and it would be difficult to find something suitable OR to ease my adaptation, but let's not go overboard.

    You are offered what you are offered by private schools. Take it or leave it, no matter what you think.
     
  10. the hippo

    the hippo Lead commenter Community helper

    I must disagree with my amphibious friend. Yes, of course an overseas package is going to be better (and different) to what you are offered in the UK (or in the US, for that matter). If I had been teaching in the UK, then I would have been able to spend more time with my mother, just before she died. No remuneration package in the world can make up for that.

    Schools are "required" to offer health insurance to all family members, as many teachers with families simply won't apply for a job if they don't.
     
  11. IndigoViolence

    IndigoViolence New commenter

    Plenty of schools avoid families for that exact reasoning. It is a shortsighted vision that sees only immediate pound signs and it is a mark of a poor school. Families become invested in the school and they stay longer thus reducing costs overall.

    Free medical and places are the expected norm because they are free in the UK- you have a choice of paying and not paying. That choice is removed internationally.

    Also the school is hiring you from overseas so it is incumbent on them to pay for flights there and back because if you’re a family, you are bringing them as a necessity not as extra luggage- it’s all part you doing your job well because you feel valued....so it isn’t a bit silly tbh.
     
  12. frogusmaximus

    frogusmaximus Occasional commenter

    In my last post, they did indeed offer insurance to all family members at prices ranging from 1500 to 2000 US dollars for a partner, and less of course for kids.

    The policy was so ridiculously overblown - you could get two pairs of glasses per year, which in effect is giving you an extra couple of hundred quid in your pocket - it made it uneconomic for any small family. I wonder who chose that policy? Oh, of course the senior management team who were set to take advantage of it like the other staff, assuming the board agreed with their recommendation, and why wouldn't they as they were advised that good quality staff wouldn't apply otherwise.

    Working overseas for me has been an absolute pleasure. My salary has been on the whole generous, in comparison with the countries in which i worked and in the UK. I find it quite surprising how many whinge and moan about the financial package all the time. If you don't like it, don't accept an offer. The economics of the situation say if the offer is too low, schools will not receive applicants. As it happens, there is an excess of teachers applying and in reality, the packages are overly generous, relative to the UK.

    Of course, in the grand scheme of things, a teacher should be paid on a level of a doctor and well above an accountant. But the world is a strange place.
     
    bensball likes this.
  13. afterdark

    afterdark Lead commenter

    Asking about health insurance seems very sensible to me.

    As a teacher that is not your problem. I would suggest that schools might want married staff as they might be percieved as more stable, rightly or wrongly.

    I have never heard of teacher complain or argue against that remuneration package except to play devil's advocate.

    If you mean you can't negotiate, that may be true but sometimes is pays to try.

    With a glut of teachers, school may well tender offers that are less attractive, some schools that is.

    I would suggest that teachers applying for jobs remember the old adage
    "if you pay peanuts, you get monkeys".

    https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/if+you+pay+peanuts+you+get+monkeys

    Say no to jobs with inadequate health insurance.
     
  14. karel

    karel Occasional commenter

    Schools are not ‘required’ to provide medical insurance for teachers or their family. Many do, but in Europe it’s normal for the teacher to pay their own, and they must take out a basic insurance according to the regulations of the country. This is the case in Germany, in the Netherlands and in Switzerland, all places I’ve worked in. I believe that same is true of Belgium.
     
  15. taiyah

    taiyah Occasional commenter

    What a narrow peice of advise considering.

    1) There are also very expensive monkeys running around on lucrative contracts.

    2) Let's not forget the teachers who work for the UN and Unicef projects who gets paid a fraction of what they would get back in their own country. You should meet at least one, it will give many teachers demanding for this and that a dose of reality.

    3) Blue chip companies pay their workers peanuts yet those iPhones, tablets and laptops still roll off the conveyor belts to a very good standard.

    Very true. Well done for debunking that "schools are required" mindset.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2020
  16. afterdark

    afterdark Lead commenter

    O what a narrow point of view that does not agree with the mindset of some people who are clearly not speaking in the interests of teachers, let's bring up some cases that do nothing to do with what we talking about...managers with teacher in their job title and places that are governmental probjects rather than private schools.

    Except Karel has done nothing of the sort. In european countries medical cover is what is purports to be for starters.

    The German system is
    "Germany has a universal multi-payer health care system paid for by a combination of statutory health insurance (Gesetzliche Krankenversicherung) and "Private Krankenversicherung" (private health insurance)"

    4penguin14 would do well to ignore the posters on here who seem to think they are posting on behalf of private school owners and/or those who are arguing against teachers saying no to contracts with poor working conditions.
     
  17. frogusmaximus

    frogusmaximus Occasional commenter

     
  18. taiyah

    taiyah Occasional commenter

    @afterdark Look at your "advice" once again "lead commentor".. Associating the word 'monkey' to those who work in lower paying (international) schools.

    Considering your profession has the word 'international' associated with it perhaps have a good long look, think.... See if using the word 'monkey' is appropriate.

    To practically apply your thoughts... There are plenty of teachers that do NOT have international medical covers in some parts of the world. Are they as you say, "monkies"? No... Most are brilliant... Good practice teachers.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2020
  19. stopwatch

    stopwatch Lead commenter

    The OP is being offered a position in Dubai. My understanding is that UAE labour law states that health insurance cover has to be provided by an employer. The get out clause is that the specific level of cover is not stated.
    Happy to be corrected on this.....
     
  20. stopwatch

    stopwatch Lead commenter

    Good idea to get other people’s advice on the offer you have been made.
    Interested to hear if this has changed your position on whether to accept the position or not.
     

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