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Discussion in 'Behaviour' started by RaymondSoltysek, Oct 13, 2011.
Oh, and I said "just about" incontrovertible. I always try to take account of people like you.
This kind of thing winds me up no end. In. Any other profession, conduct like this from a client usually results in a withdrawal of services as the basic human rights of the person have been abused. This applies to doctors, nurses, bankers in fact anyone who has a public facing job. It doesn't seem to apply to teachers. The assumption is therefore that teachers do not enjoy the same basic human rights as other people. If this is the case it must therefore follow that teachers are not human! Or am I trying to apply logic to a crazy situation. About time we started to marry human rights with human responsibilities.
This is conduct that is dreadful beyond words, and in any other workplace the person responsible would be in deep trouble. I'm beginning to think that a video camera placed in the classroom could be the answer to this, even if it was not actually switched on. The thought that the headmaster could see what they said or did, and could then act on it, might make them think twice. As I say, just the appearance of a video camera put onto your desk during the lesson could be the answer for this little sod.
from post 43
So in post 30 when you wrote
You were really spouting a load of cobblers, Ray.
Shame on you Ray. Some people on this fourm think you actually support what you say.
I work in an SEN/EBD secondary school and we currently have a similar situation with one of our year 11 boys. The pupil is currently involved in two sexual harassment allegation cases and was, earlier in the year involved in another similar situation with a female staff member. Luckily we do not have many cases like this in our school - the only 3 situations have been with the same pupil - but we dealt with the matter very seriously at the time, The pupil was suspended, a meeting was held at his home with his carers, social worker and the deputy head of our school. The pupil initially denied any incident has taken place and he was instructed to stay at home until he would admit what he had done, conceded to the seriousness of the situation and signed a contract of behaviour to allow him back into school. The female member of staff refused to teach the boy - as was her right - and the boy did not return to school for two weeks.
The pupil has many other behavioural difficulties - as do all of our pupils - but the option for the police to be involved was given to the member of staff, with full support from the deputy head and the head teacher. The police were not involved that time.
However, a year 11 girl has now made a similar accusation about the boy and he has been suspended, with immediate effect, pending a full investigation which, this time, may lead to police intervention and almost certainly a permanent exclusion.
misscake, you are fully within your rights to demand a full investigation and if you feel threatened by the pupil you can also refuse to teach him.
To the person who wrote that there was a danger in involving the police or enforcing a suspension, can I just ask, do you work with vulnerable children or children with behavioural difficulties. In my extensive experience of working with such pupils, there is a danger in not taking this form of action.
I hope this can be resolved for you rapidly and with an outcome you are happy with misscake.
Try wearing appropriate clothing for the job. Nobody should be able to peer down a teachers top.
first - remember he is doing it because he can get a reaction - learn how not to react - a blank look and a raised eyebrow is always useful; as is stepping him back and giving him the look - the slow apraising one upand down then the dismissive look. You could always tell him straight that his behaviour is disturbing and you are worried about him and will be talking to .....
I had a boy do that as I was walking out of earshot - I stopped walked back gave him a cold hard stare and said ' I heard that and don't appreciate it.' It led to a round of apologies.
Forgot to mention - never be alone with him. Make sure that there are witnesses to everything and every moment you spend with him. Don't try to discuss it alone with him. ALONE is not a good idea. Always have a witness.
Freeloader? FREELOADER? Jeez mate, you seem right up your own self important ****. Oh, has anyone mentioned shooting the little fekker?
It sounds as if this boy is engaged in inappropriate sexual conduct somewhere else and that there may be an abuse issue going on. I think getting outside help is essential. It will probably help him in the long run if this is dealt with properly because that sort of behaviour isn't acceptable. I wonder what has happened in this boy's past and what his family circumstances are?
Oh for God's sake. You choose the right forum name didn't you? you aren't by chance one of those bleeding heart liberals who caused all the problems in the first place are you? Your comment is smug in the extreme.
One teacher points out that he is being allowed to get away with it. How perfectly correct. We have wrapped ourselves up in such a politically correct environment that I am sure no one has confromted him as the perp he is. He needs to be sat down with one or two male teachers and explain the "facts of life" to this boy. He needs to know the unvarnished truth. Such as:
His behavior is unacceptable. The teacher is a women - he is a child. Would he want his mother, or his sister, being treated like this? Is the waht his father has taught him. If so, then his father is a boy too - not a man. Unless you (the boy) wants to end up in jail having these comments and this behavior being made to him by a brother named "Bubba" - on a nightly basis - he better change his ways.He will say these things to the wrong person oneday and a girl's big brother will eat him for lunch, and lighten him of his front teeth.
Alone, with two male teachers. This is no joke. I don't care how he got here, or where he thinks he's going. The "compassionate" and "caring" approach will not work and all previous channels aren't working. Someone said there needs to be the "correct" intervention. Yes. Two male adults need to educate him in the language he is speaking, alone with him. Nobody remembers the conversation. I am teaching 11 years in NYC high school. I boxed for many years and have my doctorate as well. This kid will understand nothing except plain old English.
If you keep walking on eggsshells with him, and you will just be building a bigger monster. This boy is being created by seeing fear in the eyes of his teachers - especially this female teacher. (I don't blame you, I am just stating what he is feeding - and thriving on) Also, pick the two biggest teachers you have in (or OUT of) your school. Fear is the greatest motivator in the world. My approach may be considered excessive (I do not think so), but consider the alternative.
And a teacher shouldn't have to choose her wardrobe because a little deviant-in-training is on the loose.
Forgive me but since you have been coming online making grandiose statements about the proven impact of RJ and since you, well, work at a university I thought you might actually know what you are talking about.
I'm pretty sure the person making the grandiose claims is usually expected to provide the 'very nearly incontrovertible' evidence that supports them.
In my experience the system is a tool for senior management to apportion blame or a tool to provide the illusion of action. In some cases (such as tit for tat name calling amongst groups of equally mouthy girls) the system actively causes damage when children are removed from lessons because a conference about a petty feud is deemed more important than learning.
If everyone is impressed by it then there really ought to be a lot of research and evidence for me to get tangled up in.
Again if it really does work there should be plenty of academic evidence but this is the final get out clause of the behaviour wallah isn't it - when it doesn't work blame the teacher for not doing it properly.
See my point above about the damage caused by lavishing attention on a social group of mouthy teenage girls.
If a student chooses to try and start a conflict with me it is normally because I expect them to work and they want to socialise with their friends. I'm not sure how a middle ground is going to be reached here that doesn't involve appeasement.
I don't see why any of this required a meeting which was probably documented and involved passing some of the blame for the students behaviour from them to you.
But if this child is a predator, then serious intervention/action is needed - the safety of other female members of staff and female pupils needs to be considered. If the original incident is swept under the carpet then what are the repercussions should a more serious incident happen down the line? This is the point Leonard is trying to make.
At a school I used to work at I had concerns about a pupil's behaviour, and the potential for sexually aggressive attitude towards females. I raised the issue, but being a young member of staff/worker drone near the bottom of the pyramid I was ignored.
6 months later the pupil in question sexually assaulted a female pupil.
The most logical post I've read on this thread.
Unfortunately this aspect is always overlooked.
I'd advise against this sort of action. Especially if you are a fairly new teacher in a difficult school.
I don't think its a good idea for female staff to 'appraise' a teenage boy by raising their eyebrown and slowly looking at them up and down especially if the boy has just tried to look down their top. A lot depends on context here and every situation involving teenagers and staff of the opposite sex will be different - giving generic advice is fraught with complication.
This is one of the problems with generic advice - I know some schools where the children would aggressively deny saying anything and complain about you and others who would say 'so what' following by more sexist diatribe. I'm not saying you shouldn't confront such behaviour but teachers need to account for the realities of your their working environment.