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Secondary teacher - behaviour beyond!

Discussion in 'Behaviour' started by MissyICT, Mar 30, 2019.

  1. MissyICT

    MissyICT New commenter

    Hi I’m an experienced teacher. I recently moved from a great school where I was established and I can’t say lesson were perfect but the low level behaviour I could deal with and worked well.

    Now I am lost. I have students I every class that test the boundaries but two classes in particular that are testing inY9.

    I meet and greet at the door and have a differentiated starter - they stand behind their desks at the start of the lesson. I then try to start the lesson. I can not get them to be quiet. Some of the better ones did but even them now don’t bother. So I try to get them quiet with a count down 3 to 1 slowly. Still as soon as I speak the noise starts again. I sometimes give up and just get text books out as I can do task or just write notes on the board and get them to copy, writing faster than they can.

    I have tried: differentiate lessons, changing the seat plan to sit “quiet” students together with more boisterous. These student refuse to move so that I go through consequences points, until one or 3 get removed. They don’t care. Or they just go at the quiet ones: stealing shoes, stealing equipment, books. I’ve had them throw airplanes, notes, books. They have stollen equipment, glue sticks disappear or end up hidden In the room, pouring water on each other’s books, gluing chairs, hair etc. Ive tried postive points and praising good behaviour, reprimanding in private. We are not allowed to put names on the board. I’ve called parents who say “how do I know they have done that, or you have an issue with them.”

    I plan my lessons to include: bingo, word searches, quizzes, find the answers around the room, pick an activity, cartoons etc

    I asked for SLT support (changing seating plans, students refusing to move, getting theclass quiet or the room tidy at the end) they will walk out at the end or two 10 minutes before the end and try to insure others to do this and I got: make your PowerPoint on a white background. Then I got told I’d fail my PM as I was asking for helptherefore my behaviour management needs work.

    What can I do as I dread these lessons andnever been anywhere like this. The school is rated highly both ofstedand in the community that’s why I went.

    Lost and really need some advice.
    JohnJCazorla and pepper5 like this.
  2. dunnocks

    dunnocks Star commenter

    leave. Why should you have to deal with that? Get a better job somewhere else
  3. tonymars

    tonymars Established commenter

    Sounds as if you've done everything you can and more.
    "Got told I'd fail my PM as I was asking for help therefore my behaviour management needs work"

    Words fail me. Carp school. Find amother if you can.
    agathamorse, MissyICT and pepper5 like this.
  4. MrMedia

    MrMedia Star commenter

    What you are describing is poor self regulation not poor behaviour management. It’s a distinction that more should consider.

    If you do: routines, count downs, in class seating plans and movements, school policy detentions and contact parents then you have good behaviour management.

    If, despite the above, the pupils struggle to self-regulate then the issue is with self regulation. This can be checked by comparing teacher led with student led activities. If the behaviour is worse on student led then you know it is self regulation.

    I’d move schools. However, there are answers.

    Decrease the amount of student led learning activities that happen. Decrease the amount of group or pair work. Increase the amount of teacher led. Introduce far more silent work, quizzes, writing, undertaking sequence tasks. Increase the amount of parents that you ask to come in and discuss their child's learning. Don’t go for the hardest kids first. Go for the weaker ones who will conform once their parents have to come in to the school. Also, increase the amount of importance you attach to metacognition, behaviour for learning and other self regulation type activities. There are some good intrinsic and extrinsic motivational strategies that can be deployed.

    In the meantime, find a job elsewhere.
  5. sarah_dann1

    sarah_dann1 Occasional commenter TES Behaviour peer advisor

    Really sorry to hear about this situation. It sounds like you're putting in an enormous amount of effort yet have no support.

    It demonstrates very poor understanding of staff care or training to make the blanket assertion that by asking for help, your targets won't be met. Outrageous. We could and should be asking for support on areas we are also doing well at in order to develop our teaching. Unfortunately, as others have said, it will be really difficult to make meaningful changes to the situation if SLT are not supportive. If looking elsewhere is an option, by all means do so.

    However, it may not be so what can you do to improve things yourself?

    Here are some similar threads you might want to have a look at. Year 9 is often cited as the most problematic.





    If you can, follow up on this unhelpful idea that asking for help is a sign of weakness. If SLT are not prepared to support you, explain that you will refer any parental complaints to them. Often the threat of parents complaining encourages SLT to come in to classes.

    Be kind to yourself and remember that it takes real strength to ask for help. Think about anyone who could come in to witness the students behaviour - perhaps HOY or HOD or form tutors for the worst offenders.

    Alongside this also make lessons as low impact on you as possible. Don't, at this stage, spend hours planning and preparing resources - it shortens your patience with their behaviour. Worksheets, text books etc. Minimise your input at the beginning of lessons. Then circulate and work with those who actually want to learn. If the noise/their behaviour makes this too difficult, work on getting silence using on board timers etc. Although it seems embarrassing, keep the door open to encourage other staff to hear and offer help!
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2019
    agathamorse and JohnJCazorla like this.
  6. pepper5

    pepper5 Star commenter

    Leave and find a better place to work.

    Try to add to your skill set so you can findo another job outside teaching when the time comes you have had enough.
    agathamorse likes this.
  7. MissyICT

    MissyICT New commenter

    pepper5 and MrMedia like this.
  8. MrMedia

    MrMedia Star commenter

    The class as a group don’t exist. See them as individuals and target the weaker ones. Within a very short time you’ll have isolated the real culprits and can then bring larger sanctions in against them.
    agathamorse and pepper5 like this.
  9. MissyICT

    MissyICT New commenter

    Thank you, I know there are some lovely students in the class, around 9 who are very disruptive the shoe stealing, gluing chairs etc and they say - what you going to do give me consequent points - I dont care. Today one put glue in a students hair and refused to sit in the seating plan. I went through the policy and had them removed - negative for me as I had to get SLT in what else could I do? Then it’s like dominoes, even the better students why should I sit there if they won’t? Why do I follow rules and they don’t. I’m not left with many that will following rules and stay quiet. Period 3 and no one would remain silent after count down and I broke, gave text books and said answer questions. After the lesson found glue sticks “hidden” in strange places, spare pens stood on etc. HOD comment on this as they did a room inspection. sigh
    agathamorse and pepper5 like this.
  10. MrMedia

    MrMedia Star commenter

    So line up the nine and start your campaign.

    Email to each one's form tutor - you are having issues with child, could they speak to them find out what the issue is.

    Email to HOY about the worst three. Having issues. Is there background information you should be aware of. You are just flagging their names to the HOY. Don’t worry about what they say.

    Phone call to each set of parents. Whilst little Tommy has potential, his current behaviour is preventing him from making any progress. Can you arrange a parental interview please.

    Start booking every offence formally on the school system. Escalate them to room removal. Try to get at least one removed every lesson.

    Tell the HOD you are going to have this campaign. Can you remove a child to their room during this period? Can you move the worst one or two offenders to another person's class? Mention the stress word. A HOD will jump hard on them if they are a good HOD.

    When they return from Easter, start again. Absolute zero tolerance of this nonsense. Push back with the full guns.
    agathamorse, dodie102 and pepper5 like this.
  11. pepper5

    pepper5 Star commenter

    Sound advice Mr MedIan, but why should anyone have to spend that much time, effort and resources on students who clearly do not want to learn and have zero respect. The SLT should step in immediately and take charge- not dump their job on one lone class teacher.
    agathamorse likes this.
  12. MrMedia

    MrMedia Star commenter

    Quite agree @pepper5 But dumped upon she has been. Still, even in such situations, there are ways to start cascading the work upwards. SLT don’t like extra work and can easily squish an annoying pupil hard with their power and save this teacher all the hard work.
    agathamorse and pepper5 like this.
  13. pepper5

    pepper5 Star commenter

    Yes, she will have to play the game and work the system to save her sanity.
    agathamorse likes this.
  14. sarah_dann1

    sarah_dann1 Occasional commenter TES Behaviour peer advisor

    Managing behaviour is such a time consuming and energy zapping exercise! Get support wherever you can and get the parents involved whenever possible.
    agathamorse likes this.
  15. pepper5

    pepper5 Star commenter

    Teachers shouldn't have to spend hours and hours thinking up strategies to deal with outrageous behaviour or beg parents and SLT to help.

    Going to work to teach should be pleasant and something enjoyable to do - not running after wildly behaved students. If I were the Head and students refused to follow reasonable instructions, I would call the parents to come and collect their child. That would soon stop the misbehaviour.
    agathamorse likes this.

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