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Schools 'should help children with social media risk' - compulsory lessons in Y6 & Y7?

Discussion in 'Education news' started by FrankWolley, Jan 4, 2018.

  1. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    When I was working (up to 2013) most schools had policies which basically said as you suggest. But that wouldn't solve the problems discussed on the radio today & in the report I linked to above: lost/most of the problems comes outside school hours.

    The internet isn't the same as the printed word - newspapers select materiel to publish, Facebook doesn't. (And anyway I learned top day, few school age children use Facebook much now, preferring What's App, Instagram and Periscope...among other platforms I've not heard of!)
     
  2. BigFrankEM

    BigFrankEM Occasional commenter

    So by this reasoning if a newspaper didn't bother to vet articles it published but merely printed anything the reporter overheard in the pub it would have a valid defence against libel because "we didn't actually select the materiel; the report under discussion included every single comment the reporter heard that evening" ?

    The fact that the volume published by internet sites, this one included obviously, is greater than that of a print paper by a factor of 10 to the power 9 at least, has been used as an excuse for these platforms to shirk responsibility for more than a decade now.

    It isn't true and it shouldn't continue.

    As for enforcement powers for overseas operations, when pirate radio was being targeted, the government didn't go after the people running the show, from abroad.

    They enacted laws to prohibit UK firms from advertising on these stations.

    Facebook and Radio Caroline are not the same, at all. But they are not totally different cases either.

    Where there's a will, there's a way.

    Just as anyone who has worked in English state education in the last 40 years knows that, where there is no will there are a wilderness of excuses readily available.

    Just from management, at that.
     
  3. lizziescat

    lizziescat Star commenter

    I didn't say it addressed the OP issue but my post was in response to the posts which commented on the difficulty (impossibility?) of schools policing mobile phones - including yours(?) which commented on teachers searching bags. I gave an example of a school where mobile phones were not really an issue. Alas, I sense an attitude of , 'we cant do anything about it'. A self fulfilling prophecy

    This was my point.

    There appears to be a generally held view that, 'its difficult so we cant do anything about it'. On that basis eradicating poverty, creating a fair society, dealing with homelessness, easing teacher workload, are all difficult but I believe with a will these can and should be improved.
    Do platforms such as WhatsApp (still owned by Facebook?) etc. exist in a vacuum devoid of ownership, administration, advertising revenues etc? Do we censor certain illegal behaviours in other spheres?
     
  4. CheeseMongler

    CheeseMongler Occasional commenter

    I'm not a fan of social media but I don't like the way that it's being demonised in this report. If you take every negative statement from the conclusion but take out the "online" or swap "post" for "say", they are just as valid. Eg. "I wonder what other people will think of me (online)" or "I don't have anything good to (post/say)". Haven't teachers been dealing with theses issues for years?
    Yes, social media and mobile phones have meant these issues, particularly bullying, are harder for children to escape from. However if anything, from my own experience, social media has actually made it easier to deal with these situations as a teacher. 10 years ago, if little Jonny was upset about what Billy had said/done whilst they were in the park last night, Billy could just deny it and I'd be relatively powerless. Show Billy a screenshot of what he posted last night and he can't deny it. I've then got a chance of challenging the behaviours. (Both Billy's bullying and Jonny's resilience).
     
  5. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    I'm afraid you and most other posters here, have missed the point if the article I gave a link to, and the concerns expressed therein (& on Radio this morning): it was about educating children about the use of social media, much of which happens outside school, not about pupils taking them to school.
     
  6. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    There are no compelling reasons why teachers should educate children in the use of social media. It's a rare teacher who welcomes phones into their classroom. Let teachers teach and parents parent.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
    Grandsire likes this.
  7. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    Fair enough.

    But we could apply the same 'logic' to lots of areas of life - sex education, perhaps... Or religious education...teaching about drugs possibly...
     
  8. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    I have no philosophical objections.
     
  9. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    Maybe not, but I suspect these are cases where practicalities rather than philosophies are what are more important.

    Taking your position to its logical conclusion I guess we could abolish all schools, and just let parents bring children up themselves.
     
  10. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    Then teach the bare necessities. The use of luxury consumer goods does not fall into this category.

    I have no philosophical objections. Many people home-school their children.
     
  11. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    I don't think you've read the article - it's not teaching them how to use social media, but how not to be harmed by it. Which IS school's responsibility, I'd suggest (as with drugs education, say...0

    As for Home schooling - 'many people'? Really? How many? I'd suggest it is a very small % of the total number of pupils.
     
  12. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    The second would necessarily require the first.

    It is not a school's responsibility. There is no statute to it.

    Small in absolute terms, around 30,000. This figure, however, represents a 100% increase in home-schooled children in the past six years. So, many relative to 2011 and an increasingly popular alternative which addresses directly parents' legal obligation to educate their children. Parents are not legally obliged to send their children to school.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
  13. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    I think there are many things schools do that have 'no statute' (as you rather strangely put it) behind them. If OfSTED were to require it, that would be enough. But, in this case, I suspect the proponents of more teaching about social media/how to use it safely etc. WOULD want it incl. in the NC.

    Glad you agree 30,000 home schooled children is a tiny %, a drop in the ocean.

    Wonder how many are actually home schooled for dubious reasons - to allow radicalisation, to avoid abuse being discovered etc. IMHO this is another scandal waiting to be exposed...
     
  14. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    Have you not encountered the word statute before?

    Ofsted will not require the teaching of a particular subject of topic not in statute.

    They may want.

    It is a small proportion of all school children but nobody numerate would deny that 30,000 is many children. The proportion is increasing rapidly.

    A tiny proportion, if any. That home-schooling has doubled in the last six years is a sign of growing dissatisfaction, for various reasons, with institutional schooling.
     
  15. abacus1982

    abacus1982 Occasional commenter

    Unfortunately I think it is a fact of life that we have to teach them about the perils of social media. As a parent I see it as my responsibility to educate my children on technology but I do also have a bit more knowledge of the perils and dangers due to the nature of my job than a lot of parents.

    What annoys me is that this report seems to indicate we don't do this already. We do teach the children about safe internet use, social media, being careful what to send etc. The issue is the APPS that children use are constantly changing so you constantly have to be up to date with what they are doing and using.
     
    wanet likes this.
  16. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter

    1. Statute - yes, of course I know what it means. But it is still an strange word to use in this sort of discussion (esp. when many things in schools are NOT decided by statute at all).

    2. Do we know that only a small proportion of home schooled children aren't being home schooled for dubious reasons (for example indoctrination/radicalisation or other forms of abuse)?
     
  17. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    Not at all. You suggested that teaching pupils how to use luxury consumer goods is a school's responsibility:
    I pointed out that this is not a school's responsibility:
    There is no problem here.

    It may be safely assumed that the cases you fear are rare. Each of the those things are rare generally and it is within the powers of local councils to inspect any home-schooling provision.
     
  18. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    Well, I didn't.


    But never mind, I can see that you don't really want to discuss this and we're not going to reach any agreement.


    No reason to suspect that they are rare, esp. when, as you have pointed out, the number of home-schooled children is rising.

    And, yes, it is 'within the powers of the local councils to inspect'...but, as you make have noticed, local councils are having their budget squeezed, so are they likely to be doing such inspections as often as they should? I have my doubts.
     
  19. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    Are you denying that you posted this?
    Unambiguous and emphatic.

    You would need to show that home-schooling is necessarily associated with those things you fear. You will not be able to do this,

    Understandably given that you cannot recall what you posted yesterday.

    There are no compelling reasons why schools should instruct pupils in the use of luxury consumer goods.
     
  20. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    Read post 31 to understand the context. If you can.

    [This comment/section/image has been removed for breaching our Community Guidelines/Terms and conditions]
     

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