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Schoolboy stabbed & killed

Discussion in 'Education news' started by Vince_Ulam, Oct 28, 2015.

  1. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter


    Teen Boy Dies After 'Shocking' School Stabbing

    'Police have begun a murder investigation after a 16-year-old boy was fatally stabbed at a secondary school.

    The victim, named by Sky sources as Bailey Gwynne, was attacked in a "shocking incident" at Cults Academy in Aberdeen at lunchtime.

    He was taken by ambulance to Aberdeen Royal Infirmary suffering serious injuries but he died a short time later in hospital.

    Officers are questioning a boy, also aged 16, who they detained following the stabbing within the school building.

    (News.Sky.com, 28th October 2015.)

    May Bailey Gwynne rest in peace, may his family be consoled and may his murderer know justice.

    These thankfully yet rare horrors are what we should expect as children are allowed to pass through ten-plus years of education believing that they are impervious to authority. Schools and teachers should be provided with greater disciplinary and control powers.
  2. irs1054

    irs1054 Star commenter

    Agree absolutely. It was a dreadful incident and, as you say, thankfully rare.

    However, I think the rarity doesn't give grounds to attribute it to any particular pattern. I think teachers have enough legal powers, it is the support both within and without the school that needs to be affirmed.

    In Scotland we used to have a leather strap, we called it "the belt" but in England it was always called "the tawse" , a term I never heard used in Scotland. I still have mine somewhere (a two prong heavy) as a souvenir of more barbaric times.

    Are you suggesting we revert to that?
  3. Morninglover

    Morninglover Star commenter

    This is a terrible tragedy for all involved, victim, his parents and friends, the family of the perpetrator, the school, the local community and even the perpetrator himself. No extra 'disciplinary powers' for teachers would have likely made a difference.

    Let's not rush to make knee jerk reactions here.
  4. pepper5

    pepper5 Star commenter

    Knife crime amongst teenagers is perhaps more common in places like London where there have been many stabbings of young people in recent years.

    I agree with FolkFan that disciplinary powers for teachers would have made little difference since the root of the problem is way beyond what is happening in schools - it is imbedded in the culture outside of school..

    This incident, however, will be making Heads start to think about what measures/training to put in place at their schools to try to minimise the chance of this happening at their schools.

    It is a terrible tragedy and thoughts and prayers are with everyone concerned.
  5. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter

    Thoughts with his family and friends.
  6. maurice-r

    maurice-r Established commenter

    Schools must screen pupils for weapons. Such incidents are still rare, but surely the expense would be worthwhile.
  7. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    Not here. Cults Academy is a considered a good school and is located in a relatively affluent area. Downtown Los Angeles it isn't.

    Children have two cultures, the first centring on home and the second on school. The killing happened in school and if there is one consistent problem with school culture about which most teachers have cause to complain then it is the bad behaviour of children. Allowing it to go unchecked serves neither them, their peers nor their teachers.
    hermitcrabbe likes this.
  8. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    Perhaps I was wrong to describe events of this type as rare:

    • Ann Maguire, teacher, stabbed and killed at school 28th April 2014. May she rest in peace.
    • Vincent Uzomah, teacher, stabbed at school 11th June 2015.
    • Bailey Gwynne, student, stabbed and killed at school 28th November 2015. May he rest in peace.

    What do you think? No pattern?

    Not always.

    In cases where students have been violent towards their peers, animals or property at least, perhaps, but we should as necessary be empowered to lay hands upon mainstream children, in the manner of Team Teach, in order to restrain and remove them without facing automatic criminal suspicion. If Team Teach is considered appropriate for SEN students then I see no reason why it is not also appropriate to their more capable and more belligerent mainstream peers.
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2015
  9. chelsea2

    chelsea2 Star commenter

    Never thought of Team Teach as mainly for SEN pupils - where I taught, all staff were trained in it, and it was used when necessary on any pupil. However, I'm not sure it would have been any use in this situation, which happened at lunchtime and may well have occurred without warning before anyone could have intervened (I realise we don't yet know how it happened).
  10. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    Perhaps not in this instance, @chelsea2, but I propose that its systematic use as a last resort in instances where children are being disruptive and defiant would act in the long term as a prophylactic against more serious events like this. Castle-in-the-air humanists don't like the idea that children need to be trained, but they do and some need more training than others, it's the point of school.
  11. les25paul

    les25paul Star commenter

    No I think you were right. If you consider how many thousand students and members of staff are present in a school each day across the UK and to only recognise three major events (there could be a few more) the probability of a stabbing is very rare. Probably more chance of getting hit by ligthening and certainly more chance of an accident on the road on the way to school.

    But maybe there is a pattern emerging, all these incidences have happened in the last 17 months (not counting 2 Augusts in case anyone queries my sums)
  12. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    It's a dreadful tragedy. Knife crime seems to be an ongoing problem in our society. Three recent events in schools are three too many, even if low compared to the numbers of students. I feel we need to have a system where disaffected boys can get the education to see that violence and knives are not the solution to the problems they face.
  13. Scintillant

    Scintillant Star commenter

    Many of the young people where I work buy into the gangsta lifestyle, talk in a ridiculous mid-atlantic / London yardie accent, use slang that means nothing to them, and adopt a sort of culture that has no real reference points for them. A nike tracksuit is the height of extravagance and flashiness apparently...

    Is this part of what is causing it all to fall apart?


  14. circuskevin

    circuskevin Established commenter

  15. circuskevin

    circuskevin Established commenter

    Teaching these kids positive skills is more likely to make men of them. More chance of getting jobs and assuming responsibility.

    Kevin the Clown
    phlogiston likes this.
  16. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    The boys in the photo are probably feeling disconnected from our bit of mainstream society and communicating that with the hoods and concealed faces.
    They need skills, and to be able to see a way to a positive constructive adulthood. This is true of many teens.
    I suspect the perpetrator in Cults didn't fit this image.
  17. yfel_endwerce

    yfel_endwerce Established commenter

    I, being old, saw it another way and my first thought was
    "I'd hide my face if I was dressed like that"
    monicabilongame likes this.
  18. circuskevin

    circuskevin Established commenter

    Mmmm ... I wonder why my post was removed?

    I thought I was just describing how I work with lads just like those pictured?

  19. Ktell

    Ktell New commenter

    Tragic. Thoughts are with his family, friends and school staff.
    Vince_Ulam likes this.
  20. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    How about now?

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