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retired teachers

Discussion in 'Scotland - education news' started by mister8, Sep 2, 2011.

  1. In my LA retired teachers and in particular retired head teachers get regular supply work. They automatically get onto the supply list if they request it when they are retiring. Many LA supply lists are closed and newly qualified teachers and other young teachers cannot get onto supply lists. When a LA supply list closes does it still include retired teachers?
     
  2. In my LA retired teachers and in particular retired head teachers get regular supply work. They automatically get onto the supply list if they request it when they are retiring. Many LA supply lists are closed and newly qualified teachers and other young teachers cannot get onto supply lists. When a LA supply list closes does it still include retired teachers?
     
  3. Katie_Morag

    Katie_Morag New commenter

    In my school (a large school) the vast majority of supply work is done by retired teachers from that school. As a staff member on a temporary contract, a particularly when I was coming into the school as a supply teacher myself, it really does annoy.
    More so when said retired teachers say that they need the money as their pension just isn't stretching as far as it needs to for their foreign holidays. I'm sure the job seekers allowance isn't stretching as far as it needs to for last years probationers. Some of them need to know when to step aside and let the younger ones get on with it.
    In saying that, if you are in a school on a temporary contract and most of the supply is being done by retired teachers then you have more of a chance of getting any permanent job that may come up as the school isn't getting to know any younger unemployed teachers who are on the supply list. Ruthless I know, but sadly true.
    Sorry, that's a bit off topic. In my LA I think retiring teachers need to apply to go on the supply list and have an interview, although it's very rare for anyone to not get on the list. It has not closed down, and I don't think there's any plans to close it down, so it's a slightly different situation.

     
  4. fairytaleangels

    fairytaleangels New commenter

    Well is the government not trying to get rid of retired teachers doing supply by dropping the salary to £18000, you may not see so many retirees this year in schools. Can't see many getting out of bed for that salary.. Hopefully anyway..
     
  5. Flyonthewall75

    Flyonthewall75 New commenter

    Or perhaps LAs, and schools, want to keep all their options open in case the worst happens.
    There are plenty of schools, in remote areas, that rely on local staff. They may want to offer work to an unemployed teacher on the supply list but is it always practical?
    If a teacher phones in sick on the day in question and the nearest, unemployed supply teacher is 30 miles away, what are the options? Book the unemployed, supply teacher to arrive by 10 o'clock, traffic permitting, or call on a retired supply teacher who lives around the corner.
    That's before one factors in snow and road conditions or an outbreak of winter vomiting. Education happens in real time and you can't just leave classes, and pupils, in an 'in tray' until tomorrow.
    The SG, and LAs, didn't drop the salary for short term supply work to get rid of retired teachers. They did it to save money and they may live to regret it.
    It is possible in some areas that neither unemployed, or retired, teachers will be interested in supply work at a reduced rate of pay. If you factor in a long commute or the cost of petrol, is it worth it?
    However, I'm sure parents will understand if they are asked to keep their children at home.[​IMG]
     
  6. As a recently qualified teacher I understand the frustration that can be caused by seeing retired teachers come in to do supply work. However, it is only the current lack of jobs that is creating this situation. Generally retired teachers only want to do a few days or weeks supply to top up pensions. NQT's are generally looking for full-time jobs. Although it is tempting to say that retired teachers have had their time, only 10 years ago it was retired teachers doing supply that kept schools open during a shortage of teachers. Most decent headteachers attempt to give NQT's a chance. Hopefully in a few years time the situation will change again. In the meantime I am just going to hold on to the hope that things will get better for me eventually.
     
  7. catmother

    catmother Star commenter

    My department would have been left without a member of staff during the entire course of a maternity leave if it had not been for 3 retired teachers. Do not imagine that those were the only people to have been contacted;the job was advertised and interviews conducted. However,we were let down by the person who had been appointed and again,let down by the next one who was offered the job.
     
  8. <font size="2">Many older staff retire because of their ability to top up pensions by doing supply. Stop retired staff doing supply and you may find even less permanent full time jobs available for new teachers.</font>
     
  9. To be fair is some areas then the retired teacheer is the ONLY option. I know for a fact that a local retired teacher keeps her ears open for new supply so she can turn down work in favour of them, she just found one lass new to the supply list 6 weeks work.
    We have advertised posts and had no applicants, the retired supply was the only way we could fill the post and keep it ticking over.
     
  10. ScotSEN

    ScotSEN Senior commenter

    Although we are in a city but probably because we are ASN we too have had to rely on retired tired to keep things going as we have been let down my other staff.
    The point about teachers retiring early knowing they can top up thier pension on supply,thus freeing up full-time posts for younger staff is well made. I was hoping that once I got within a few years of retirement to early and do some supply but now that I'd be on point 1 I don't think I'll be abel to afford to do that.
     
  11. Yeah...well...that's all very well...think about the folk that cany get a start. It's just not fair, and if folk looked to their concience, the answer lies there.
     
  12. Flyonthewall75

    Flyonthewall75 New commenter

    If folk looked to their conscience, they would admit that too many teachers have been trained for jobs that simply don't exist.
    The point has been well made that most newly / recently qualified teachers should be in full time, permanent posts, not struggling by on supply work.
    Okay, successive governments, and their advisers, have been less than 'competent' in their teacher recruitment planning. So, what is the solution?
    They could just sit it out and hope the teachers they have trained, and continue to train, will make do with a reduced salary on unpredictable supply, or alternative, work until a permanent teaching job turns up.
    They could suspend all teacher training until there is a need for additional teachers but that would have implications for those working in ITE institutions and the teacher training infrastructure.
    They could suspend the probationary year for all new trainees. That would free up a substantial number of vacancies that, every year, have to be held back for probationer training. It may risk losing the well intentioned principle of having a supported probationary year but, let's face it, are some LAs and schools not already using probationers as flexible, in house, supply teachers.
    They could allow more teachers to take early retirement, with an element of enhancement. Yes, this would cost LAs and/or the SG money but, then, so does training teachers for jobs that don't exist. Using retired teachers, and those who wish part-time employment, for supply work and giving the full time, permanent jobs to the unemployed / supply teachers who need the work makes a lot more sense and brings in more money for HM Revenue and Customs.
    It shouldn't be forgotten that just ten years ago there were teacher shortages and schools had great difficulty trying to find supply staff. How things have changed in a very short period of time.
    Of course, the bottom line will probably be that we can't afford it. We can't afford to have children, and young people, educated in our schools by professional teachers, on permanent contracts, and already it would seem our LA employers are using and considering other 'cheaper' alternatives.
    So much for an education system fit for the 21st Century.
    (P.S. We could probably also learn a thing or two from our 19th Century predecessors about how to build tram networks, within budget, and schools that last more than 40 years.) [​IMG]
     
  13. Love it!
    And the rest of your post too [​IMG]
     
  14. Like others, if we couldn't get retired folk in we wouldn't have staff to cover some days.
     
  15. So why are we all sitting on the brew looking work then? Somebodies lying here and it is not me.
     
  16. Depends on where you are. We often have to use retired teachers cos nobody's prepared to travel to our rural school.
     
  17. Yeah...true in rural locals...the ones in the cities should be ashamed. Also private schools are full of them. Selfish people.
     
  18. Why shouldn't they be selfish (playing devil's advocate). Why should someone give up their cushy lifestyle so that some young upstart can get a chance at a bit of supply?
     
  19. I mean...how are they going to fund the three cruises a year...? [​IMG]
    But private schools are choxablock with them...made my blood boil on a few occasions.

    It is so shortsighted by 'de management'. They say, retired teachers have a wealth of experience and knowledge. I say, how are new and younger teachers suppossed to get that experience and knowledge in the first place.
    I sometine despair about some teachers/management ability to think ahead for more than 3 days...

     
  20. I mean...how are they going to fund the three cruises a year...? [​IMG]
    But private schools are chocablock with them...made my blood boil on a few occasions.

    It is so shortsighted by 'de management'. They say, retired teachers have a wealth of experience and knowledge. I say, how are new and younger teachers suppossed to get that experience and knowledge in the first place.
    I sometine despair about some teachers/management ability to think ahead for more than 3 days...

     

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