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Resignation or Dismissal

Discussion in 'Workplace dilemmas' started by nil_satis_nisi_optimum, May 21, 2019.

  1. nil_satis_nisi_optimum

    nil_satis_nisi_optimum New commenter

    Hi all,

    Please can someone help me with a query?

    I am mid-disciplinary procedure and, like many others it appears on here, feel like I am being bullied out of my job by my HT who can replace me with a nice, cheap NQT.

    If I hand in my resignation now and then the worst comes to the worst regarding the disciplinary procedure, what happens? Does the dismissal trump the resignation or vice versa?

    Thanks.
     
    FormosaRed likes this.
  2. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    Sorry you're in this place.
    Dismissal trumps everything and makes fresh work hard to find.
    Resignation with a HT point of view reference may not be much better.
    If the disciplinary is to do with safeguarding pupils rather than competence, resignation may not stop the procedure.
    You need to talk to your union, or maybe use an employment solicitor to get advice focused on your difficulty.
    Good luck.
     
  3. HolyMahogany

    HolyMahogany Occasional commenter

    Sadly your story is a common one on these pages and I hope you can find a way through this.

    You say you are mid-disciplinary. Depending upon the structure of your schools capability system I will assume that you have gone through the informal process and are now facing the formal process.
    If you resign before the formal process begins, and the HT is prepared to suspend the formal process and give you a reference, then moving on ASAP is your best option.
    The informal process does not need to go on your reference. See NEU link for more advice
    https://neu.org.uk/advice/disclosing-capability-information
    Do speak to your union and if the stress and anxiety is an issue see your GP.
    Remember if the HT's objective is to get you to leave with the minimum of bother to them they will probably prefer to to avoid the formal process since it is not good for the staff morale to be putting people through capability. After all other staff will start worrying about their own position.
    Work on your exit plan and good luck.
    you are not the first and you won't be the last to go through this but you can get through this.
     
    Shedman, pepper5 and grumpydogwoman like this.
  4. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Union.

    If they want rid of you then you explore the possibility of leaving on your own terms.

    A settlement agreement. With this you get an agreed reference. It used to be called a compromise agreement and that was a more honest name for it.

    Essentially they want rid and do get rid but without hanging you out to dry and may even have to give you a bit of extra pay. Whereas you didn't really want to leave but make sure you get a fair and accurate reference and maybe even pay for a month or two to tide you over.

    Union.
     
    Shedman, Piranha and livingstone83 like this.
  5. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter

    As the posters above say, you need Union support ASAP. I really would NOT resign without an agreed reference etc.
     
    pepper5 likes this.
  6. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    A school can continue the disciplinary process and even dismiss you during your notice period. The head might feel it isn't worth continuing with it if you have resigned. But that may not be a good thing for you. Especially if safeguarding allegations are involved. Reference requests might ask if there were disciplinary allegations that the school was unable to reach a conclusion on because you resigned first. Don't resign without getting union advice on how this may affect your circumstances.


    That's solely about capability though, OP is in a different process, disciplinary. Although informal capability does not have to be disclosed under the statutory regulations the NEU guidance is clear that regulations do not prevent disclosure. A head is still under a general legal duty for references to be fair and accurate.
     
    nomad and pepper5 like this.
  7. Piranha

    Piranha Star commenter

    If this is one of those trumped up charges against somebody whose face fits, then the school will probably be more than happy to end it with an SA and an agreed reference. If, however, the Head really believes that you have done something worthy of disciplinary action, then it is less clear. References are supposed to be accurate, so agreeing to one which is not accurate could cause trouble later on. In either case, the advice to work with the OP's union is vital. The union should be able to say if there is anything of substance in the charges.

    I think this is key. A school which allowed a teacher to leave with safeguarding charges unanswered and didn't mention it in a reference would be in serious trouble if something similar happened again. Not a risk worth taking. Safeguarding policies have to be followed to the letter.

    I am not making any judgements about this situation, just pointing out the possibilities.
     
    Rott Weiler, nomad and grumpydogwoman like this.
  8. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Below I've randomly posted one school's NOT exhaustive list of possible reasons for an accusation of gross misconduct.


    Let's say it was f. You had taken a laptop home. That was the allegation. And intended to keep it. But you contest that.

    Or i. You'd taken your class on a visit to your cousin's petting-zoo and paid her £200 without declaring that interest. But you claim that you'd told your Head of KS2 before you set it all up.

    Then (essentially grey areas resting on one person's word against another) you can reasonably engage on negotiating a settlement agreement. If you're confident enough to take it to a tribunal if the worst came to the worst. You stand a fair chance. It all depends where you stand really in relation to the nature of the allegations against you and the evidence.

    Union every time.


    https://www.stjosephs-primary.org.uk/Policies/Disciplinary-Policy-and-Procedure/

    (a) Conduct incompatible with, or prejudicial to, the religious character of the School or the precepts or tenets of the Catholic Church

    (b) Conduct that is likely to bring the School or the Church into disrepute

    (c) Conduct giving rise to any Child Protection issue including, but not limited to, a change in your DBS status during the course of your employment

    (d) Failure to disclose your DBS status/submit to a DBS check where requested to do so by the Headteacher and/or the Governing Body

    (e) A serious breach of any relevant code of conduct or professional standards

    (f) Theft of any property

    (g) Malicious or wilful damage to any property

    (h) Knowingly or recklessly falsifying, or knowingly or recklessly causing falsification of, any documents whether for personal gain or not

    (i) Ordering any goods or services on behalf of the School from a supplier in which you or a relative have a personal interest (whether financial or not) without declaring that interest and without the permission of the Governors’ Finance Committee

    (j) Dishonesty

    (k) Violence to any person

    (l) Unlawfully restraining a pupil

    (m) Abusive threatening or offensive language or behaviour to any person


    (n) Unlawful discrimination or harassment

    (o) Bullying

    (p) Deliberate refusal to carry out a lawful and safe instruction

    (q) Absence from work without leave or reasonable explanation

    (r) Disclosing the contents of any live examination paper or assessment in advance to any pupil or parent
     
    Rott Weiler, nomad and Piranha like this.
  9. ridleyrumpus

    ridleyrumpus Lead commenter

    You are mixing up Capability and Disciplinary procedures, they are different.

    Your link was in regard to disclosing Capability whereas the OP is facing a Disciplinary process.
     
  10. ridleyrumpus

    ridleyrumpus Lead commenter

    Unless you had warnings on file already it would be unusual to dismiss at Disciplinary unless it is Gross Misconduct, but check your Schools policies and talk to your union..
     
  11. HolyMahogany

    HolyMahogany Occasional commenter

    You're right - A timely reminder to read twice before replying
    Thanks
     
  12. caterpillartobutterfly

    caterpillartobutterfly Star commenter

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