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recent meeting of SNCT - EIS response

Discussion in 'Scotland - education news' started by braemar, Jan 19, 2011.

  1. braemar

    braemar New commenter


    <table style="width:100%;border-collapse:collapse;"><tr><td style="background:#f1f7fe;">Pay
    The Teachers&rsquo; Side submitted a claim for a pay increase which would meet the key principles set out in the remit of the SNCT.
    The response of both COSLA and Scottish Government was to indicate that they would not offer any increase in pay &ndash; both for 2011/12 and 2012/13.
    </td></tr></table>Interesting that they talk about cutting our annual paid leave entitlement to 40 days. Would this mean we would have to work an extra 25 days (5 weeks)?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The Scottish Government and COSLA also set out demands for changes to certain conditions of service which would reduce the paybill by &pound;60m. The changes they proposed, in return for unspecified staffing promises, include:
    (1) Removal of Lifetime Salary Conservation.
    (2) Short term supply teachers to be paid at Scale Point 1 and only for teaching hours.
    (3) Freeze on entry to and progression through the Chartered Teacher Scheme.
    (4) Cutting annual paid leave entitlement to 40 days.
    (5) Increasing maximum probationer contact time from 0.7 to 0.9 of that for a fully registered teacher.

    No agreement was reached on any of these matters. The Teachers&rsquo; Side sought concrete staffing commitments from employers, in advance of the next meeting scheduled for Wednesday 9 February 2011.
    Ronald A Smith Drew Morrice
    General Secretary Assistant Secretary



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  2. braemar

    braemar New commenter


    <table style="width:100%;border-collapse:collapse;"><tr><td style="background:#f1f7fe;">Pay
    The Teachers&rsquo; Side submitted a claim for a pay increase which would meet the key principles set out in the remit of the SNCT.
    The response of both COSLA and Scottish Government was to indicate that they would not offer any increase in pay &ndash; both for 2011/12 and 2012/13.
    </td></tr></table>Interesting that they talk about cutting our annual paid leave entitlement to 40 days. Would this mean we would have to work an extra 25 days (5 weeks)?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The Scottish Government and COSLA also set out demands for changes to certain conditions of service which would reduce the paybill by &pound;60m. The changes they proposed, in return for unspecified staffing promises, include:
    (1) Removal of Lifetime Salary Conservation.
    (2) Short term supply teachers to be paid at Scale Point 1 and only for teaching hours.
    (3) Freeze on entry to and progression through the Chartered Teacher Scheme.
    (4) Cutting annual paid leave entitlement to 40 days.
    (5) Increasing maximum probationer contact time from 0.7 to 0.9 of that for a fully registered teacher.

    No agreement was reached on any of these matters. The Teachers&rsquo; Side sought concrete staffing commitments from employers, in advance of the next meeting scheduled for Wednesday 9 February 2011.
    Ronald A Smith Drew Morrice
    General Secretary Assistant Secretary



    [​IMG]
    <table style="border-collapse:collapse;"><tr><td>




    [​IMG]
    <table style="border-collapse:collapse;"><tr><td>

     
  3. GuessWho

    GuessWho New commenter

  4. sbf

    sbf

    They want to knock 5 weeks off our pay.
    Probably works out at &pound;200 per month pay cut for most.
     
  5. Please excuse my ignorance - are proposals from the Scottish Government and COSLA at this stage in these types of negotiations usually so drastic?

    How have negotiations in previous years developed? It's obviously difficult to predict but which of these items, if any, are likely to be agreed upon?

    Apologies if these questions are impossible to answer.
     
  6. halfajack

    halfajack Occasional commenter

    So that's what it means, is it? A pay cut by another name? God help us!
     
  7. halfajack

    halfajack Occasional commenter

    When is that EIS meeting in Glasgow? I can't find my flyer.
     
  8. holdingon

    holdingon Occasional commenter

    just make sure you spread the word about what they are trying to do

    this is going to get very nasty indeed
     
  9. We don't get paid for summer anyway...*wanders off to check what current paid leave is*
     
  10. Wrt holidays, I would suspect that most teachers need holidays to recuperate after the school year (am I wrong?). Increased stress -> increased sickies. Perhaps even increased "sickies" - after all, you can self-certify for up to a week . . .
     
  11. I have been saying for a few years now that training so many new teachers to meet the much-vaunted "demographic timebomb" (of a kazillion teachers retiring) would backfire. It looks like that prediction will be correct because there's too many teachers, hence the attack on wages.
    Time for working only 35 hours per week.
    I should really have put these last three messages into the one post.
     
  12. ryeland

    ryeland New commenter

    And of course - the consequence of the over training - lots of us do not always have access to any sort of wage - or holiday entitlement.

    Many of us face being booted off supply lists, and the survivours are looking at sub minimum wage levels if they pull a bad year.
    The proposals are also rather transparent in that COSLA likes the abuse of the induction scheme so much, that it would like another slice of cheap, use once then chuck, labour.
     
  13. Precisely, rye.
     
  14. The way I read the 40 days thing was that if you're off long term sick or on maternity leave, you can claim at the moment up to 65 days of holidays - under the new proposals you could 'only' claim 40 days. We'd still get our holidays - we're not paid for them anyway from what I can gather. We wouldn't lose any pay as far as I'm aware.
     
  15. Freddie92

    Freddie92 New commenter

    Seems to me that once again Teachers are the whipping boys of the political elite.
    First thing we can do is boot out the SNP and get Labour back in. Jack McConnell - a former Teacher himself - looked after us, and at the end of the day everyone looks after themselves.
    Why should we bear the brunt of the mistakes of bankers who are still receiving their bonuses? They are being rewarded for catastrophic failure.
    If they do touch holidays there will be no-one left in teaching. Even today some of my colleagues are thinking of packing up and going abroad. I have to confess for the first time in my life going to Australia or New Zealand is looking far more attractive than being battered about here.
    The Press and others like to make our job out to be all sweetness and light, but we all know that there are days when the job is superb and we get our perks (like the long holidays) but we also have very dark days also. We are not working with mature adults who can toe the line. We deal with immature kids who cause us to be teachers, social workers, amateur psychologists, and bouncers on a daily basis.
    This is what wears us down. Pupil indiscipline and inaction from superiors. All the powers have been taken off of teachers to keep order in the classroom. And yet they wonder why standards are falling?
    So now they are going to hit us in the pocket, meaning that the catch-up deal of McCrone will be consigned to history. Remember it was only to get us to parity not to overtake other professions.
    So will the Police still be able to retire at 50?
    Industrial action now looks inevitable, with pupils suffering. Ironically the first cohort of CfE will be the ones who will suffer most. The knock-on effect to our already illiterate and innumerate workforce and economy will be calculated not in millions but in billions.
     
  16. davieee

    davieee Occasional commenter

    I reckon the 40 days holiday is the bit management will concede on and effectively they have put it on the table so they can take it off.

    Even so, my own interpretation of this part of the proposal is that it would remove paid holidays from the summer break (or equivalent). I believe the current entitlement is around 69 days therefore teachers could potentially lose up to 29 days holiday (or almost 6 weeks) which equates to roughly an 11% wage cut.

    Again this is only my interpretation of it and maybe someone higher up the negotiating food chain could possibly clarify this for all of us, but if this is the case we are in for an almighty fight.
     
  17. I was under the impression that we are not paid for holidays, only the hours we work and our wages are spread out over the year, including holidays. 'Leave' may just mean compassionate leave etc. If your average teacher has &pound;200 knocked off his/her pay every month we'll have thousands of teachers having to sell flats/houses because they can't afford their mortgages etc. (including myself). Surely things won't get that bad, will they?
     
  18. This is what I thought too, mossop, but it would be a big help if someone would come on here and explain it for certain.
     
  19. halfajack

    halfajack Occasional commenter

    We are paid for holidays. For every day we work we accrue a third of a day's holiday.
     

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