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QTS Skills maths test question

Discussion in 'Trainee and student teachers' started by thechameleon, Jul 10, 2007.

  1. Hi, in this test are you allowed to have a pen and paper?

    Its just that ive been trying the practice test on the tda and I'm struggling to remember all the question in the mental arithmetic bit. just want to jot down the numbers and then work it out in my head.

  2. Hi, in this test are you allowed to have a pen and paper?

    Its just that ive been trying the practice test on the tda and I'm struggling to remember all the question in the mental arithmetic bit. just want to jot down the numbers and then work it out in my head.

  3. ~Yes you will be given some paper and a pencil to make notes while you listen to the mental arithmetic questions.
  4. Oh good! Thank you
  5. I have a friend who has sat the numeracy test 67 times. They have passed two sections of the test and say they only needed 5 marks to pass overall. Can anyone confirm the average pass mark for each section. I understand it to be 6 or more on each section.
  6. How can the QTS Numeracy test be fair when I was in one school where they were using teaching assistants to teach classes on their own and one particular person I knew had only got Grade E on there GCSE Maths. Why should these TA's be allowed to teach children when people with degrees are being told you must have the numeracy test in order that you can gain QTS.

    The Government is concerned about standards they need to inform headteachers that TA's are not allowed to teach in the classroom unless they have sat the Skills Tests as well. Schools are usign the TA's as cheap labour and people with degrees and qualfiied PGCE students across the North West are without work.
  7. The QTS Skills tests are not intended to judge whether you have the knowledge to teach the subjects (Maths, English and ICT) but whether you have an adequate grasp in order to complete your professional role as a teacher. For example, the maths test is heavily biased towards simple statistics as you might use in understanding pupil data. The English test is about the use of language in scenarios relevant to a teacher (meetings, reports etc).

    By the way, to reply to the OP, yes you can and should use pencil and paper in answering the 'mental arithmetic' section - they are actually provided by the test centre. To my mind this means that it isn't actually mental arithmetic but there you go - it would be near impossible without the use of paper!

    The first time the question is read, jot down the key figures. This means that you can start the calculation immediately (assuming you can blank out the second reading). Only if you are unsure should you bother listening a second time. In every case I found myself staring at the wall willing the program to move on to the next question (unfortunately there is no way to manually advance the questions in this part).

    As I understand it, there is no 'pass mark' per section, only an overall pass standard.
  8. sonver - 67 times???? Im thinking that sounds like bulls**t - could be wrong but im wondering where he has managed to fit in 67 trips to the test centre and going to school and uni!

    There is no pass mark for each section. You may only get low marks in one section but if you score full marks in other section you will pass.
  9. msy


    Schools are usign the TA's as cheap labour and people with degrees and qualfiied PGCE students across the North West are without work. - Sonver

    While I totally agree that TAs should not be teaching whole classes, please remember that a lot of us lowly TAs also have a degree, mines a 2:1 btw and I recently worked with the holder of a first, a teacher with a young family who's planning to return to teaching later and some OU students.
  10. msy - the fact that you have a degree does not change the argument. Your degree was not a prerequisite of employment as a TA and, unlike your experience, the vast majority of TAs/LSAs with whom I have worked have few if any formal qualifications. Many have been entirely open in telling me that it is just a job that fits in with their own domestic situation better than shelf-stacking in Tesco. I should say that I work in secondary so acknowledge my ignorance of the primary situation.

    By the way, when sonver referred to "people with degrees..." it was my reading that this implied "with teaching degrees...".
  11. For each section there are actual marks given such as:
    Mental Arithmetic = 12 marks

    Using and applying general arithmetic = 9 marks

    Interpreting and using statistical information = 7 marks

    17 = 60% is the overall mark that is needed to pass the numeracy test.

    I was seeing if people do actual pick these things up. However I'm sure some people do and others don't. Anyway the reason why my friend is so concerned is because he has had quite a few printouts that have stated on them that he has only needed 3 or 4 or 5 or 6 to pass the test. The last test he sat he had passed the 2nd and 3rd sections. However the mental arithmetic was the one that let him down. Before he sat this test he had practised the material himself and gained extra tution from outside that helped. Also he had found out from reading some information from a test centre that people only need to get the average mark or more on each section to pass. Therefore when he sat the test, he knew that he would try to focus on getting 6 or if more answers right on the mental arithmetic section because this is his weak point. During the test and after it he again rechecked his answers by writing down what he had done and any parts of the questions that he had a go at. When he counted them up and checked with someone else to make sure they get the same results he did get over 6 mental arithmetic questions right. I think he actual got 8 right in total on that one section. The other sections had been passed. So the reason why he his so conderned and asking other people is because if others are saying that you only need to pass the other sections fully but the marks on the 1st section may appear to be lower (but still above the average mark of 6) then, why has he not passed this test? If there has been error in the system then why has this person not passed his maths before according to the figures up above. Something does not make sense here. It is the only test he needs to get because everything else has been passed. Unless the tutors at the Universities decide on who passes and who doesn't and possibly how many per year?

  12. He might not have actually typed in the answers he thought he did? Thats just me guess.

    There is honestly no conspiracy as to people passing - its the same rubbish as people who can pass their driving test come out with.

    If you think about it logically it wouldnt be in anyones interest to make your friend fail. It would look bad on the uni to have a failure and the TDA would have wasted thousands of pounds training him.
  13. Anyone else's advice would be helpful. Apart from Blah! again. The answers weren't incorrect either because they were rechecked with another person who understood Maths. So i think something is not right when other people say they can pass with two sections but not gainning full marks on the other i.e. gainning just as the average mark or more to pass the test. Any suggestions!
  14. no need to be rude about it!

    I think your "friend" needs to accept they are messing up. There is no conspiracy, but plain failure.

  15. Geez.....I took the practise test yesterday! I knew it was going to be hard, but no idea it was THAT hard!!! I think I answered one question right out of the whole lot!! Uh oh...!
  16. honestly if you just keep doing the practice questions over till you have all the skills you will be fine.

    I found (anyone else think so?) that the real questions where just re-hashed versions of the practice ones.
  17. Hiya

    I've done a few of the practice tests now and the QTS web pages state clearly that there's an overall pass mark - not a pass requirement in each section of the test. The test is just a simple run through of about 30ish questions, 12 of which are 'mental' arithmetic. As I understand it, your marks are added up by the computer and you get your result immediately so there should be no room for conspiracy theories!

    I have been failing the numeracy one because I didn't realise you could use a pen and paper for the 'mental' bit - I am VERY relieved to find out you can!

    As somebody else already mentioned, the QTS tests are not a test of subject knowledge, but whether you have enough grasp of maths and English to carry out the 'extra' duties of a teacher, like data recording/analysis and report and letter writing etc. i have a degree, but haven't studies maths for 17 years - I fully expect several TAs to have better knowledge than me, and to have to some serious revision before I teach a numeracy lesson!

  18. I did the benchmark and practise papers on the tda website, they were much more challenging than I expected, especially the audio part.

    I don't think it's got much to do with whether you've done well at maths in the past. It seems it's a matter of doing basic arithmetic very quickly under pressure, so unfortunately it might just come down to loads of practise.

    Anyone know if the exams were a bit easier than the practise papers? Sometimes they make the practise bit harder so you're well prepared for the actual test.
  19. Does anyone know when these have to be taken by? i.e can we do them when the PGCE finishes? Or will this affect our getting a job? When do people tend to do them? Im nervous that the PGCE sounds so intensive yet so does the revision for the tests!
  20. You can take these any time after you are registered onto your course. My College recommends getting them out of the way early. Every year the centres have waiting lists towards the end of the PGCE year full of people who wait til the last minute to sit the tests and then find they can't get into a centre. You can't qualify fully without the QTS Skills passes and schools may not interview you without 'full' QTS so get them done sooner rather than later!


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