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Priti Patel: Bullying claims from time at DfID revealed

Discussion in 'Personal' started by chelsea2, Mar 4, 2020.

  1. Orkrider2

    Orkrider2 Star commenter

    it’s not my construct of a ‘patriarchal socialisation’ paradigm. Its society’s. I didn’t create the sayings like ‘crying like a girl’ ‘throwing like a girl’. I didn’t decide that men who don’t display traditional macho traits, or who like to wear makeup or paint their nails are ‘effeminate’.
     
  2. Kandahar

    Kandahar Star commenter

    You will have a long wait I fear.
     
  3. ilovesooty

    ilovesooty Star commenter

    I've told you where to find it.
     
  4. Orkrider2

    Orkrider2 Star commenter

    So you disagree with it?
     
  5. Kandahar

    Kandahar Star commenter

    [This comment/section has been removed for breaching our Community Guidelines/Terms and conditions]
    Oh! Is that what matron was attempting to say. Silly me.

    As I assumed - you condone this language.
     
  6. ilovesooty

    ilovesooty Star commenter

    Does a misogynistic stereotyping comment cease to exist because it was originally made on another thread? We don't have to wait long for one from you anyway.
     
  7. ilovesooty

    ilovesooty Star commenter

    And you keep repeating a post that the moderators deleted. I doubt if their purpose in deleting it was to have you continuing to quote it.
     
  8. Orkrider2

    Orkrider2 Star commenter

    I didn’t ‘just’ say I’m entitled to my opinions and you to yours, as you well know. I laid down my interpretation previously. I didn’t realise you needed a full recap on everything said before in each post. But just for clarity, here’s what I also said about Toxic masculinity.

    ‘It refers to a restrictive set of stereotypes about what makes a man a man, which can be harmful to the sense of self-worth in young men.

    You clearly disagree with my interpretation, and I don’t agree with yours.
     
  9. alex_teccy

    alex_teccy Star commenter

    Men who wear make up are effeminate, if that’s how a society expresses femininity.
    If they’re wearing war paint then that’s masculine.
    Every society has effeminate men and masculine women and has different levels of toleration depending on the socio-cultural landscape.
    And no, you didn’t create cryinglike a girl etc but you are using them to create a narrow archetype of what constitutes gender.
    The social roles hypothesis has no coherent paradigm of learning. Because I don’t think social roles are entirely socialised learnt, they have an evolutionary context.
     
    Kandahar likes this.
  10. alex_teccy

    alex_teccy Star commenter

    Human -and animal- societies are hierachal. Because men are in positions of power does not make human hierarchies patriarchal, per se, since men also constitute the majority doing dangerous low paid work, and women can rise to positions of power.
     
    Kandahar likes this.
  11. alex_teccy

    alex_teccy Star commenter

    Yes, it’s a worse case archetype of masculinity.

    You want examples. Here we are with people jumping on any hint of female stereotypes I e playing bingo- yet deploying Male stereotypes is regarded as socially acceptable.
     
  12. alex_teccy

    alex_teccy Star commenter

    You mean the thing about bingo? I didn’t post it so why do you have any expectation that I am obligated to respond to your question?
     
    Kandahar and Orkrider2 like this.
  13. ilovesooty

    ilovesooty Star commenter

    I didn't say you were obligated. You criticised stereotyping and I thought you might have an opinion on that. It seems you dont.
     
  14. Orkrider2

    Orkrider2 Star commenter

    and I think that’s where we inherently differ. While evolutionary psychology has some influence on how we interact, I believe in today’s society much of it has become unnecessary and in some instances undesirable, so we as a species are moving on. Personal choice governed by societies moral codes and legal systems are more influential on our actions than basic evolutionary traits.

    Men constitute the majority of that work because barriers were put in place to stop
    women entering those workforces. Just as men held power, because women were routinely denied power wherever possible. Women throughout history (and children) have worked as much as men, on farms and in factories doing physical work until legislation was brought in to prevent it. The idea of a man being the breadwinner while women stayed at home working (for free) keeping house and looking after children is a relatively new phenomenon that didn’t emerge until the mid 19th century. so it’s not part of an evolutionary thing, but rather society’s design. A society that then was run largely by men.
    And yes, things have changed and women can rise to positions of power, but they still face barriers that men do not to a greater or lesser degree.
     
  15. Orkrider2

    Orkrider2 Star commenter

    So you agree these stereotypes are toxic?

    and again, the difference is the bingo reference was deployed as a stereotype designed to disparage women, while all I’ve done is point out that negative stereotypes for men exist, I’ve not judged any man against them.
     
  16. Kandahar

    Kandahar Star commenter

    Oh that'd be me.

    Light hearted humour which is way above the heads of posters who prefer hardcore insults.
     
    alex_teccy likes this.
  17. vannie

    vannie Star commenter

    Too numerous to count. Mostly I just sigh inwardly and let it go but when the *usual suspects* start to tag team it does get really tedious. The same *usual suspects* that treat a bloody chat forum like some kind of gladiatorial contest.
    Provide you with evidence? Naaah. Can’t be bothered.
     
    ilovesooty likes this.
  18. Kandahar

    Kandahar Star commenter

    [​IMG]
     
  19. vannie

    vannie Star commenter

    Indeed. Smart cookie our Lauren.
     
  20. ilovesooty

    ilovesooty Star commenter

    Yes it was you. No it didn't go above my head. Your posts are often misogynistic and your attempt to put other people in the wrong for failing to understand you simply doesn't wash imo.
     
    Burndenpark, Orkrider2 and vannie like this.

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