1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Hi Guest, welcome to the TES Community!

    Connect with like-minded professionals and have your say on the issues that matter to you.

    Don't forget to look at the how to guide.

    Dismiss Notice

Police Caution

Discussion in 'Governors' started by hal_ber2000, Feb 27, 2007.

  1. I'm a male prospective candidate for teaching. Last November, I was cautioned for having sex in a public place with my partner. We were admittedly drunk and reckless and landed ourselves a police caution. Is there any use in me proceeding with teaching as a career, or will my declaration render a school with no option but to refuse me?
     
  2. I'm a male prospective candidate for teaching. Last November, I was cautioned for having sex in a public place with my partner. We were admittedly drunk and reckless and landed ourselves a police caution. Is there any use in me proceeding with teaching as a career, or will my declaration render a school with no option but to refuse me?
     
  3. cbl

    cbl

    That's a very difficult one but to be honest I suspect we would probably not interview you.
     
  4. Good god, how narrow minded of people!

    I don't see wht you should not apply. If all people thought like this, I would probably not have a job for some things I have done in the past. Go for it!
     
  5. The reason is that the caution would have to be disclosed. Thats the law. And it will probably go to the CP officer and may be reported during CRB checks. Now if I had a choice between 2 otherwise equal candidates, but one had such a cution and the other had not, to me its a no-brainer. Why take a risk? And its a risk, that the OP might be someone who engages in inappropriate sexual behaviour. So why take the risk? Just choose the candidate without the caution. Its not about closed minds or prejudice. Its about risk.

    Can I suggest to OP that they need to do the following:
    1. Go and see your solicitor and find out if schools can lawfully exclude you for this.
    2. If they can, then consider your options.
    3. If they can't then surely you are laughing.
    4. If, as I think, its a grey area then you need to decide if you want to spend some time trying to overcome the hurdles.
    If so then
    5. Think about being up front in all your applications. Tell them about it early.
    6. If there is a possibility of a site familiarisation visit before applications then take it. Talk to people. Mention your problem. Suggest that you may not make the shortlist, but show that you are - in essence - a good person.
    If not then
    7. Complete your studies and then look for other work
     
  6. thanks for comments so far. I wonder where I can get affordable legal advice.
     
  7. ...I do have experience working in schools and can get character references from them. Will this help?
     
  8. cbl

    cbl

    The important thing is that the caution will always need to be disclosed in an application, be that this year or in 20 years, and you will always need to clarify the reason for it. That's because when working with children and young people, there is no expiry on any cautions, bindovers or convictions. Also failure to disclose is itself grounfds for dismissal.

    And yes, the reason for the caution will give cause for concern. A recent recruitment exercise was to consider a list of 10 or so things which might come up on a CRB and consider a suitable response and generally anything linked to any sexual act would be considered a risk.

    Are you in teacher training? Why not discuss this with your tutor? Legal advice or not, you need to consider if you could ever prove that the caution was the reason for not shortlisting by any prospective employer.
     
  9. I thought cautions were removed 3-5 years later? That is what the Sergeant in the Police Station told me when I voiced these same concerns at the time of cautioning. He even came close to an apology saying we were just 'in the wrong place at the wrong time!' I know for teaching we require an enhanced disclosure, but that is the only kind of disclosure a caution shows up on anyway. So what is the point in removing it if the disclosure just indicates where one used to be? I thought that even if I can't take up a teaching post now I shall be able to in 3-5 years time but this would excluse me for life. This is very frustrating as i'm in training and feel like there's no point in carrying on.
     
  10. cbl

    cbl

    No. Because of the nature of the job, it is exempt from a time limitation. You will find that all applications forms say something along the following lines:

    "Because of the nature of the work for which you are applying, this post is exempt from the provisions of Section 4(2) of the Rehabilitation of Offenders
    Act 1974, by virtue of the Rehabilitation of Offenders 1974 (exceptions) Order 1975 and the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974
    (Exceptions) (Amendments) Order 1986, the Police Act 1997 as amended by Part V of the Protection of Children Act 1999. The fact that conviction/caution(s) have been reported against you will not necessarily debar you for consideration for this appointment.

    You must, therefore, answer the question below: "have you ever been convicted of a criminal offence or cautioned?" (please answer "yes" or "no"). If the answer is "yes", you must give details which may, if you wish, be enclosed in a separate, sealed envelope marked 'confidential' and attached to the application."

    I am unsure of how to advise you and strongly suggest discussing this with your tutor. In terms of any caution, although it must always be disclosed it is likely to be less significant over a period of time and with other experience to your credit. However in all honesly because of the nature of the offence, it is something we would be concerned about.
     
  11. cbl

    cbl

    I should add that I do know of instances where someone with a caution (though for a different cause) has been offered employment so it is a judgement call and will depend on the circumstances and the interview panel.

    Talk it through with your tutor. This is not the time to make a rash decision about something so important as your career.
     
  12. OK thanks. I've heard of cases where teachers have had affairs with students and not been sacked. I'm loath to compare myself with such behaviour, but am hoping it means each case is judged individually...
     
  13. On application forms you are asked to disclose any convictions.

    Will the people looking at the application forms decide not to interview on the basis of seeing you have a conviction?

    will they tell you " we decided not to appoint/ interview because of your conviction " sure as hell they wont tell you this.

    I guess if you are interviewed and seen as the best candidate you will be appointed.
     
  14. As for seeing a solicitor to find out if they can lawfully exclude you! Schools are able to appoint without stating to non appointed candidates "we are not appointing because of your conviction".

    I have seen people not appointed for various reasons, none of which ended up being revealed to the candidate.

     
  15. I should have stated that it would be a good idea to ask one of the teaching unions they would have more knowledge on this than 99.9% of us on here.
     
  16. I have just filled out an application form which had no reference to convictions. I have a very old conviction, it did not stop me from getting the teaching position I already have, I was upfront at interview and it helped me to get job, as they said I have life experience, I have been in the position some errant kids find themselves in and found a way out, therefore they want my experience. However, my convictiond are long since spent, and do not involve sex of any sort.
     
  17. cbl

    cbl

    "I have just filled out an application form which had no reference to convictions."

    If you are really saying that a school is sending out an application form which makes no mention of the requirement to disclose convictions, cautions, etc, either directly on the form or separately, then that school is acting contrary to every tenet of personnel and LA advice in every county and cannot be using a standard form.
     
  18. You should confirm thatyou actually received a caution. Police officers often fail to record these infringements. Check with the police station/office or request a copy of your PNC file. Its worth investigating before doing anything hasty. I know of several cases where cautions have not been recorde.
     
  19. frustum

    frustum Lead commenter

    As I understand it, the details of the caution should not be revealed to the entire interview panel; only to whoever is responsible for deciding whether it is an issue (probably the head/LEA). I think the decision as to whether you can be considered for the post is supposed to be entirely separate to the comparison with other candidates. Having said that, I suspect that the decision of a head with 100 applicants may tend to differ from the head with 2 applicants.
     
  20. I am also worried about the same thing. I am coming to the end of my studies and found myself in a situation a few weeks ago. The result was that I became involved in a 'fight', I have never been involved in anything of the sort in my life (and I am in my mid 20's). I was arrested, alongside three others and have been posted bail. I must return at the end of the month to see what I will receive. The inspector told me that I should only get a caution. I am very worried and upset because I feel like I have destroyed my career over an incident that should never have occured! Any advice?
     

Share This Page