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Please shine some light on the QTLS - QTS situation

Discussion in 'Further Education' started by shaun63, Mar 5, 2011.

  1. Can anyone truly shine some light on this QTLS - QTS thing?!!
    When would it come into force and can someone explain why FE teachers are seen to be lower than schools teachers?

    Thank you

    Shaun
     
  2. Can anyone truly shine some light on this QTLS - QTS thing?!!
    When would it come into force and can someone explain why FE teachers are seen to be lower than schools teachers?

    Thank you

    Shaun
     
  3. You're now a bit out of date, shaun [​IMG]
    The nice Mr Gove just decreed that there shall no longer be a difference.
    Have a look on the IfL site for details.
     
  4. Thanks Pobble, just checked IfL.
     
  5. Hmmm, just pondering this and what it could me for me (and other FE lecturers).
    So, I'm HoD of Music (plus other management role) and teach Music at L2 and L3, exactly the same provision as schools offer at KS4 and 5. I've got experience of working in schools, have been an LEA governor for donkey's years and have a pretty good CV (even if I say it myself!).
    I could apply for and get a HoD job in a school, possibly also get a SLT job as I'm also management. I've just looked at the Teacher's Salary Checker here on TES and, OMG, what a difference! It just highlights what lack of parity there is between the sectors for a start.
    Also, I only get a fraction of the holiday entitlement that teachers get and my PPA (as it's called in schools) is NOT protected in any way at all (the opposite, actually).
    Am I an idiot for staying in FE I wonder?
    How many good teachers will now leave FE?
    What the heck will happen to FE if that happens?
    Sorry, I'm musing whilst I type but, really, this is quite a big deal when you think about it.
     
  6. Not many for three reasons.
    Firstly there have to be jobs to go to. Many in FE teach subjects that have no comparison in schools.
    Secondly, assuming they teach something also taught in schools, and that are good at it, then they have to compete for those jobs with good teachers with QTS and experience of teaching in schools.
    Thirdly, many school teachers move to FE, and take a pay cut, just so they can teach L3+ and to avoid break duty. My staff room has three ex-school teachers. No-one wants to teach in a school, what they want is to teach in FE, but on the same money.
     
  7. Anyone who actually understands education knows it.
    And there's the rub.
    To understand this you need to unpack what in inside QTS.
    In essence it is 120 days in a school being observed by school teachers against standards that apply in schools. And that's what makes a PGCE with QTS different from a PGCE FE.
    I have QTLS. All I did was fill some forms in. Bit of a drag, but no more than that.
    I also have QTS. It nearly killed me. But it means I can prove that I can handle bottom set Y9 on a windy afternoon. Been there - done that - but choose not to.
    Given a choice, school HoDs appointing staff are always going to choose QTS over QTLS, whatever Gove says. And we will continue to be paid less whatever the IfL says.
     
  8. Yeah... but couldn't we just have 48hours to dream about the 'what ifs...?' before you soak us in reality? Please? I need a bit of escapism just now - coursework deadline looms!
     
  9. Ditto what Po says!
    Yes, I can see that some of the points that Jude and Shirtandtie are completely valid. As I say, I'm just musing (or dreaming!).
     
  10. Could someone clarify - does Gove saying he 'accepts immediately' the recomendation that we can work in schools mean (in theory anyway), we can start applying for work in schools? Or will there be some process that needs to pass first (with us or Gove/govt)?
     
  11. ...and at my meeting next week with IfL and with ministers, we will be pushing for this recommendation to be accepted by the government.”
    Baroness Margaret Sharp
    Hi Dianeak, theres a meeting next week with Maggie Sharp above, check IfL site out.
     
  12. Why is it always about money with teachers??? WHAT ABOUT THE YOUNG PEOPLE AND THEIR NEED FOR A QUALITY EDUCATION???
    I sometimes (when one feels like amusing oneself) read these forums, bickering, bickering and more bickering. Oh Dear!!!
    I am highly qualified in my specialist subject, a published author, and a Scientist Practitioner, an Academic if you will. I am about to add another string to my bow and undertake a PGCE leading to QTLS. My aim is to teach my subject, without worry about my pension, my salary, equality with my teaching peers...etc etc...I want to deliver my subject to a wider audience, and as such, whether my renumeration meets that of my QTS colleagues is of no importance.
    I would only choose to work in a school, once the government, who are doing a super job reforming the current Education System (hats off to Mr Gove...may he long continue), make teachers understand that it is all about the young people and their learning that is top priority.
    Where I understand that there is a tremendous amount of work involved in teaching and it is not in any way a matter of turning up at 8.30 am, doing a stint in front of sometimes unreasonable young people, and popping of home at 5.00 pm or thereabouts. Stop, stop, stop teaching people with QTS, worrying about QTLS people coming in and pinching your jobs, please think about whats best for your charges.....GET A GRIP...I PROMISE I WON'T ATTEMPT TO STEAL YOUR JOBS..and...............................I don't think you need worry about a mass exodus from the college staffroom to the school staffroom, stop getting your knickers in a twist, turn that frown upside down and do the job you are getting paid for....THINK ABOUT THE KIDS, DON'T GO ON STRIKE ON WHIM AND......ACCEPT THAT IN THE PRESENT ECONOMIC CLIMATE WE ALL NEED TO PULL TOGETHER...and finally.......see ya, don't aspire to being ya.....

     
  13. Paying the rent. Planning to support myself without having to rely on the state or my childrens' help in my dottage.
    Good luck with that.
    He will be so re-assured.
    I dare you to go into the staffroom of your childrens' school and suggest to the occupants that they are doing anything other than making your childrens' learning their top priority.
    A word to the wise; avoid references to underwear in staffrooms. It never turns out good.
    When was this?
    And what will be my reward when the economy improves? A Christmas bonus perhaps? Upgrade on the company motor? Jolly away days to country hotels?
    It will be none of these things.
    So I intend to fight to keep my modest income/pension.
     

  14. And what will be my reward when the economy improves? A Christmas bonus perhaps? Upgrade on the company motor? Jolly away days to country hotels?
    It will be none of these things.
    So I intend to fight to keep my modest income/pension.

    Good for you shirtandtie - I would add....and pray that your college doesn't screw you over in its latest round of restructuring. Being highly qualified, experienced and a good teacher is no guarantee of being kept it seems. Decide who you want to keep and then rewrite all job descriptions to fit the profile. That's the way to do it nowadays.
     
  15. When one feels like amusing oneself, one also often reads these fora. This one however is well aware of the turmoil in FE and the threat to the education of our youth by the never ending restructuring by the self-preservationists. That's why so many lecturers are looking at the security of school.
    In the meantime this one's college management continue to employ their family in consultancy, award themselves pay rises on the back of the savings from redundant lecturers and look forward to a fruitful pension.
    No reason to go on strike really? Just the realisation that my job is under threat and at 50 I would be highly unlikely to get back into the job that I love.
     

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