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Phonics related - how would you teacher this

Discussion in 'Primary' started by mystery10, Jun 7, 2011.

  1. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    What do you consider rapid?
    The flaw in that is that children will be using different vocabulary so writting different words
     
  2. mystery10

    mystery10 Occasional commenter

    By rapid I am thinking along the lines of entering reception with no letter-sound correspondences, not writing own name, not sounding out or blending or recognising any common words to reading at approx a reading age of approx 6.5 to 7 years by the Easter of year R. I'm not saying that they are using the best method, but that they seem to get good results and this is maintained up to 13. Of course it's not a fair comparison with the average school as it is selection by purse strings.
    Oh sure there's a big flaw in looking at commonly mispelt words at year 6 level as every child will have different sorts of errors, and as you say will be using a different vocabulary. There is still something of use in it despite all that. Had a glass of wine so struggling at the moment to define clearly what that is!!

     
  3. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    It's quite possible to achieve in a bog standard primary school in a deprived area using phonics.
    I've had children enter reception with no letter sound correspondence, not writing etc and leaving with a reading age of 10+
     
  4. The other flaw is that there isn't a standard for misspelling. Kids misspell differently and for different reasons.
     
  5. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    and the same child may spell a word correctly and incorrectly a number of times in the same piece of writing ... and often get words consistently in spelling tests and wrong in creative writing
     
  6. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    that should say leaving reception with a reading age of 10+
     
  7. Dear Mystery, I hope that despite Msz's objections u will start a thread on the lines of
    'Most often misspelt words in Yr6'.
    I think it would be better if it was not started by me, because my name has become akin to a red rag to a bull for some people. They follow me like a swarm of angry wasps and repeat lies about me, like me having my books vanity published or knowing nothing about English spelling and its history or phonics. Hemmingford is a good example.
    Pegasus did not charge me anything to publish them and continues to distribute them. But they charge if they think that the book someone wants published is not really worth publishing. I think one of the latter started the myth about my books being vanity published.
     
  8. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    What Masha means Mystery is that most teachers on here laugh at her lists ...
     
  9. mystery10

    mystery10 Occasional commenter

    Msz I've no doubt that there are children leaving bog standard state reception classes coiuntry-wide with reading ages of 10+. But what I was saying is there are some schools that will never achieve that (and it's not always due to intake) because of lack of pace in their phonics teaching and lack of practice at home because they don't send readers home at all or often enough.
    Also I think it is possible to achieve something similar without pure synthetic phonics teaching - even though that might be best for the majority of pupils. But I was really thinking out loud and musing that you could end up being an excellent speller in Year 6 with spelling teaching that did not depend on having started out reading down a pure synthetic phonics route. Again the SP route and logical progression onwards from that in a spelling programme might be best for the mjaority of all pupils but not necessarily the only way.
     
  10. I think the multisensory spelling method is the best method to use.
    Try Alpha to Omega or Hickey
    If your child is having problems maybe try toe by toe
     
  11. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    mystery there are some children who appear to be natural readers and make good progress without phonics (often these children are the ones struggling with spelling in Y6 and beyond) but for the majority of children a good solid phonic foundation is the best way to become readers and writers.
     
  12. Haven't you noticed that Masha has been spamming the same old tosh for years on every forum imaginable.? She refuses to discuss because anyone who disagrees is "stupid", "doesn't understand," etc, etc..She's an evangelist a bit like a Jehovah\s witness. She's right so there's nothing to discuss.
     
  13. Dear Andy, Thanks a million for explaining so clearly the harassment I am up against. A few others have tried too, but none have done it quite as well as u. I am quite a tough cookie, but persistent rubbishing of what I say does annoy even me sometimes. (I can't understand why the TES tolerates personal attacks. I feel it demeans the whole website.)
    I persist because from the many emails which people send me privately after finding my website or blogs, I know that many teachers and students find them really useful, and that spelling is a huge problem fro many people. So I am keen to make them better known, but the likes of Hemingford, Maizie, Msz and quite a list of others are from the category u have described so well and pounce on almost every post by me now.
     
  14. mystery10

    mystery10 Occasional commenter

    It has always quite interested me that some of the same things that happen in real life "group dynamics" also happen in virtual life on a forum. There are some positives - with persistence in virtual life people get rehabilitated into the acceptable category in the same way that sometimes happen in real life. The advantage of forum life is that it really is virtual so none of it really matters. You wouldn't really be able to trust someone as a good friend in real life who had previously been part of the abusive "in-gang" but forum life is virtual so it just doesn't matter.
    I don't understand how people can be so downright rude sometimes in forums but I just remain positive and hope that this is only their virtual self, not their real self, and what's it matter anyhow. Some of the arguments are interesting on the TES threads, but yes when they descend into the downright rude I still wince inside.
    Moderation is an expensive business I guess, and although what is said on here could be hurtful at times, it's not the kind of stuff that your average moderator or moderating software would be looking for.
     
  15. moonpenny

    moonpenny Occasional commenter


    I thought Andy's post was really good.
    It makes you realise how fairly ordinary people ,who are pretty harmess on their own, can be drawn into this sort of group brainwashing.I know it is extreme but how did Hitler get the backing of ordinary people when his philosposopy was so warped. Makes you think how people are influenced by others opinions on here.....
     
  16. The people you insist are "stupid" and "don't understand" have considerably more expertise in the subject than you. That can be seen from what they write.You count as rudeness anything that disagrees with you. You are unable to tolerate a dissenting view and that can be seen in your bleating that TES moderators aren't removing enough dissenters. You want a world of followers and that is something you are not going to get.You have suggested that a list of words copied from a dictionary is evidence. It is not. Not only that but you are frequently wrong on pronunciation, make up history to suit your cause and are about the rudest poster on the subject.You need to understand that your hobbyhorse is trivial in the extreme and because of that your spam is irritating. It is also dangerous because you might give people who don't know better the impression that they might as well give up because it's the language that is at fault. This is a forum and it means that opinions other than yours can be expressed regardless of your objections. It means that people who recognise your spamming as twaddle are able to say so. It is important that they do. You're like the God botherers who cry "blasphemy" and in the past could have objections removed.
     
  17. Hitler and Stalin didn't allow dissent. They would probably wonder why TES allows dissenting views.Tat' irony by the way.
     
  18. Adults misspell some of the same words over and over. (See list of 20 below from Daily Telegraph).
    So I think Yr 6 teachers would probably be easily able to come up with 10-20 words which they have to keep correcting. It would be interesting to see if they overlap or not and to consider why those words keep being misspelt.
    I am going to be away on and off this week and not saying much. So if u started another thread on this, Mystery, Hemming might not keep barging in with his irrelevant comments about me.


    <font size="3">1. Separate </font><font face="Calibri">2. Definitely </font><font face="Calibri">3. Manoeuvre </font><font face="Calibri">4. Embarrass </font><font face="Calibri">5. Occurrence </font><font face="Calibri">6. Consensus </font><font face="Calibri">7. Unnecessary </font><font face="Calibri">8. Acceptable </font><font face="Calibri">9. Broccoli </font><font face="Calibri">10. Referred </font><font face="Calibri">11. Bureaucracy </font><font face="Calibri">12. Supersede </font><font face="Calibri">13. Questionnaire </font><font face="Calibri">14. Connoisseur </font><font face="Calibri">15. A lot </font><font face="Calibri">16. Entrepreneur </font><font face="Calibri">17. Particularly </font><font face="Calibri">18. Liquify </font><font face="Calibri">19. Conscience </font>
    I can see reasons for people misspelling them, except 'referred'. Can u?
    But many of those words are not ones Yr6 would be expected to spell 'correctly'.


     
  19. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    There will always be those gullible few who listen to even the most crackpot ideas [​IMG]
     
  20. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    Why?
    my nemisis word isn't on the list [​IMG]
     

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