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Pay and conditions for FE

Discussion in 'Further Education' started by oggs26, Dec 3, 2019.

  1. oggs26

    oggs26 New commenter

    I'm currently on supply in a place i rather like, a vacancy has arisen. I know the pay scale is different in FE, are the holidays the same as the website and job application doesn't say anything about the holidays etc.
    I know they finish early so i would expect an earlier return date.
    Any advice
     
  2. SammyBear2016

    SammyBear2016 Occasional commenter

    Some FE Colleges will shut down over certain holidays but for the majority you do not get the same holidays as in a school. The College i work at gives you 25 days annual leave a year (for a FT member of staff) and on the whole you are expected to take this during periods when the students aren't in.
     
  3. physicsfanboy

    physicsfanboy Occasional commenter

    I made the hop from secondary to FE this year. I absolutely love it.
    The pay is slightly less
    The hours are longer
    BUT
    You are treated like an adult.
    The students are older, and not required to be there. This changes their attitude remarkably.
    When students misbehave, the college can and does chuck them out.
    The classes are smaller.
    The marking load is less, even taking the above into account.
    The students are sorted by ability, and you don't get very low ability students in high ability classes or vice versa.
    You have about the same teaching hours, but more time in the day to do useful stuff.
    There is virtually no pointless paper / data / 'training' / drivel from pole climbers.
    The college actually sends you on useful training.
    You don't have to wear formal clothes (makes a bigger difference than you'd think).
    You don't have to faff about with managing students uniform.
    The responsibility for achievement is more balanced. The students are expected to take responsibility for their own learning as well as me doing my bit.

    I may be fortunate in being in a good college. The biggest difference is I actually enjoy work now. I no longer carry around the huge cloud of amorphous dread that I had in secondary. The pay may be a bit less, but the difference in conditions is astronomical.
     
    greenjumper and Flanks like this.
  4. geraldbeattie

    geraldbeattie New commenter

    Well done physicsfanboy for getting a good college to work at. I used to work at one like that, but years of poor and weak management led to it evolving into the toxic employer from hell.
    Pay was less than secondary and still is in many cases.
    True, students are older, but with poor funding, they were certainly not thrown out for misbehaviour, or drugs, or failure to achieve arbitrary targets.
    Classes are smaller, can't argue with you there. 25 was the maximum ever.
    Sorted by ability, true, level 1, level 2 or level 3.
    In theory, about the same teaching hours, but hope none of your subject team go off ill, or you might end up doing cover, "for the good of the students".
    There is virtually no pointless paper / data / 'training' / drivel from pole climbers. No sorry, in my experience there was plenty of this, especially from people who had not taught a class for 10 years.
    You don't have to faff about with managing students uniform. Very true.
    The responsibility for achievement is more balanced. The students are expected to take responsibility for their own learning as well as me doing my bit. No, sorry completely disagree with this one. It was entirely my fault if a student or a cohort did not achieve, irrespective of their circumstances or demons. A colleague had a below target success figure and was chastised by the data pole climbers. Apparently death is no reason for non-completion of a course. Nor was leaving mid year to get a very good apprenticeship with a high profile business.
    For oggs26, the original poster, in almost 20 years in FE , I never knew anyone who was teaching who managed to take leave in term time. Non-teaching managers often enjoyed a May two week foreign holiday when the prices were lower.
    I escaped from all this four years ago.
    If you get a good college, it can be an absolute dream of a job. If you get an imploding toxic college it can seriously affect your life, health and well-being. Look at the staff who are still there. Do they trudge in and out, struggling with paper, data, pointless marking?
    Or are they bright and breeze in and out having done a good job within the normal working week?
    Best of luck, and hope you get a good one.
     
  5. physicsfanboy

    physicsfanboy Occasional commenter

    Looks like I simply lucked out. It helps that my immediate boss is excellent, and his boss appears ok too (only spoken to him twice so don't really know yet).
    What's very telling is that for my current boss, I will do far more. It actually makes more sense in terms of productivity to be a good boss.
     
  6. Flanks

    Flanks Senior commenter


    Same is true in a lot of schools, sometimes we get lucky :)

    I think FE has a particular leadership issue. The chronic under-funding for years has lead to a real difficulty in recruitment for leadership in colleges. Not even in the teaching areas, but also in things like HR/Financial management/principals etc, very few of them would be employable at similar levels in schools and take the jobs as stepping stones.

    I used to work in a beautiful college. It had a strong principal, who moved on (right time for him). After that they appointed a new one, who in the next two years appointed her old friends to every SLT position and made damn sure the only SLT who were teacher facing took early retirement, all backed by a financial manager who couldn't even evidence students existed when ESFA showed up for an audit. Such a shame! But when you looked at the jobs advertised, their salary, etc, it was no surprise that there was a lack of quality candidates.
     
  7. timedout

    timedout New commenter

    I have just walked away from working in FE after 26 years. As others have said, there can be some differences in culture between one college and another but from my experience it is a hugely toxic sector where underfunding has resulted in low salaries and having to take any student and retain them regardless of behaviour or ability. Integrity is not valued and register fraud and grade inflation are the norm.
     
    JJ83 likes this.
  8. oggs26

    oggs26 New commenter

    Thank you for your answers on this
     

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