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part-time contracts and training days/staff meetings etc??

Discussion in 'Pay and conditions' started by littlerussell, Dec 5, 2011.

  1. littlerussell

    littlerussell New commenter

    You have to work 4/5 of the duties of a normal teacher, but how exactly those hours are allocated is a little more complicated and the headteacher has the ability to direct you up to 1012 hours a year (4/5 of a normal teacher's 1265). Furthermore, they should only be directing you to work on your normal days.
    If the non-pupil day is on a day you don't work, then your attendance is voluntary. If it is on a day you do, then it is the HT's right to direct you to be there, so long as they don't go over the annual 1012 limit.
  2. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    You are free to refuse to attend any meetings/INSET/parents evenings on the day that you don't work only.
    If you agree to attend on that day, it should be with extra pay at the full hourly/daily rate for supply teachers (thus getting the pro-rata holiday pay for the time worked built into the hourly/daily pay).
    If all the INSETS/meetings/parents eveinings fal on your 4 days at work, you should make sure that you will not exceed your reduced Directed Time budget by the end of the year.
    As you will be on ML later in the year, you should get Union help if you think that work day extras before ML will take you over DT limits for the part of the year before ML.
    Is the day when you are hoping not to attend one of your usual work days?
  3. frustum

    frustum Lead commenter

    How you inform/ask the head depends a lot on their general attitude. In some schools, you probably have to cite STPCD to convince them you don't have to attend on your non-working day, or demand your directed time breakdown.
    However I have worked with heads who've been quite happy with a quick verbal request: "Given that I've been to more parents evenings/meetings than pro rata, and the January INSET day is less relevant to me, would it be okay if I skip this one?" Some do operate a common sense policy!
    If the INSET day is one that you normally work, I think you need to be asking to skip it rather than notifying them. (If you don't normally work that day, informing is fine, as they shoudn't be assuming you'll be there.)
  4. Many thanks, it's on a day that I normally work but everything always is!!! (Friday is my day off)
    I'm going to total up all my directed hours so far and contact my union - it's the fact that I'm going to be off on ML that is the big issue really.

  5. erm


    But if the INSETS are all on Fridays then if could be that you are also working one less regular day. (If the INSET you want to take off had been scheduled for a Friday, then the day you want to take off would be a regular school day and you wouldn't be seeking to take it off.)

    The meetings/parents' evenings you may have a point with (once you've counted up your directed hours), but I think to have all the INSETS scheduled on days you work doesn't make any difference. You will still end up working the same number of days, it's just a higher proportion will be INSET. I never see any part-timers wanting to make up the teaching days they will be down as a result.

    ROSIEGIRL Senior commenter

    whartonj - your head is right in that INSET is important, especially for team-based training.
    It's also nice to feel free to say 'no thank you' when it's irrelevant or difficult or too expensive to attend.
    BUT ... does he also agree that you should be paid for the extra days you do work when you do attend training on days that you are not contracted to work?
  7. He does pay for the extra days. Last year, the overtime for part-time workers in our school for cross-over days, training days, putting two people on courses instead of one cost over £8,000 (needs to be reduced to £3,000 this year but this is still expensive).

    THEYOUNGBARD New commenter

    I too am interested in these posts, as a part-time teacher (3 days per week). In the past, under our previous Head, I gave freely of my time and felt that I frequently went above and beyond the call of duty (carrying out a lot of school related work on my unpaid days at home, attending extra training days unpaid etc.) I wouldn't have minded so much if it had been appreciated but I really felt I was taken advantage of - the Head knew I was dedicated and a perfectionist and could therefore rely on me to do this without having to pay me! As we now have a new Head, I'm determined this won't happen again. This Head seems very fair in her approach. However...our Assistant Head has already started to question my pro rata entitlement, asking if I should be attending Inset days even if they aren't on a day I usually work (he started to mention fractions of attendance at Inset, as the first post here, but I don't believe that is correct). He has also timetabled me to do an extra yard duty on alternate weeks. There are staff who work more hours than I do each week who are doing less yard duties. Feels like I am being picky over 15 minutes and I have therefore agreed to the extra duties as I know it has been difficult for him to timetable and I appreciate this fact. Thought I'd check with the NUT though. Seems the yard duty situation is a bit of a grey area since any teacher can be directed to cover yard on a day they work, regardless of their status as full or part-time (hmmm, seems a bit unfair to have more duties than a full time member of staff though, would anyone agree?) More importantly though, the Union have said that part-time staff only have to attend meetings and Inset on days they usually work in a normal week. If Inset falls outside these days then you do not have to attend. If you want to (for CPD for example) then the school should pay you to do so. I'm still a little confused over weekly meetings though...my colleague works a day a week less than I do and, as she doesn't work on our set weekly staff meeting day, she does not have to attend. On the occasions when we have been covering something important, she has been paid to come in. Also, she has been paid to come in for Parents' Evening for the same reason. I, on the other hand, attend every weekly meeting and Parents' Evening as they always fall on one of my working days (Wednesday). Don't want to start being petty and calculating percentages for directed time but really believe there should be fairness here! My full-time colleagues are paid considerably more than I am and I often feel like a full-time member of staff on a part-time salary, for all the time I spend on my 'days off' doing school work! Any advice please?
  9. chriszwinter1

    chriszwinter1 New commenter

    There seem to me to be four separate issues here:
    <ol>[*]What you agree with your HT is no business of the AHT. A reasonable and fair HT can be undermined by an ill informed AHT.[*]I'd agree about the yard duty being a grey area. It's within directed time and therefore he can ask you to do it.[*]The STPCD is clear about not working on days for which you are not paid &ndash; paragraph 162. What you have typed in bold from the union is correct, as is your colleague's situation. She can be paid as she is attending on days when the school has no claim to her time.[*]As for working in your own time (please don't refer to it as "days off"; it's not), the school and the STPCD would argue that that's your choice.</ol>

    THEYOUNGBARD New commenter

    Thanks for your advice. I wonder though, where you have mentioned (re. my colleague) about the school having 'no claim to her time', would that not also apply to me, after 4pm? Sometimes our weekly meetings can go on until 5.30pm and Parents' Evenings considerably later. It does sound as though I am being too picky but it gets you thinking this way. I take your point about my own time (they do feel like days off!) but the fact is that, as English Co-ordinator, if I didn't do school related work on these days then I wouldn't manage to fit everything in!
  11. chriszwinter1

    chriszwinter1 New commenter

    The pay and conditions document makes no allowance for a teacher who for example may well finish at 11 a.m. and who is still expected to attend a meeting at 3.30 p.m. As you are paid 0.6, I'm assuming (and please correct me if I'm wrong) that you are paid for 52 weeks, so that being paid for the holidays means that you are compensated for evenings that fall under directed time. If on the other hand, you are hourly paid, it's a different matter. I appreciate that you feel that you're doing more than your share.
    As for the end of meetings they should be accounted for in the school's time budget. Others might jump down my throat for this but I cannot see why a meeting should need to go on until 5.30 p.m.
  12. frustum

    frustum Lead commenter

    Your protection is the pro-rata directed time limit. If all the meetings and parents evenings fall on your days, then that could take you over your directed time (which is the appropriate proportion of the 1265 hours). Add it all up, see if it does. Then you would be justified in saying "actually, that extra yard duty will take me over my directed time", or even "because all the meetings are on my days, I'm way over on directed time: can we look and see what it would be best for me to miss".
    The English coordinator work is a bit different, as it's not directed at any particular time, so it's probably not relevant to that discussion. It might be worth asking about a day off-timetable or an extra paid day if you think the demands are enough to justify that request.

    THEYOUNGBARD New commenter

    Thank you to you both - good, sound advice! I would agree that meetings regularly lasting beyond 5.30pm are not always necessary.
    I have decided to make a note of my directed time this term to see how it all adds up. You are correct in saying I am on 0.6 so the holiday allowance makes sense in the light of this (although I assume I am paid 0.6 of the holiday time, since my salary as a whole is 0.6). My, this gets fussy and complicated! To be fair, I will now be getting some time allowance for English although, as I'm sure everyone will agree, this is never enough time in reality to get everything done. That's just the nature of the job, I guess...
    Would school clubs during lunch hours and time spent after school at concerts with the choir, for example, count as directed time too, or is this voluntary (I offer to help with choir and also run a Book Club for students)?
  14. coppull

    coppull New commenter

    They are voluntary.
    We assume you will not be doing them,if you do not receive a pay rise this September[​IMG]

    THEYOUNGBARD New commenter

    Think your 'winky' has the answer to that one!! We're all just too 'soft' for our own good in this profession.
  16. Nellegant

    Nellegant New commenter

    Hi, I work 3/5 of a week and attend every staff meeting. Becoming tiresome, esp when new and very green phase leader's power has gone to her head and she's implemented another meeting. You guessed it, on another of my 3 days . . .
  17. strawbs

    strawbs Established commenter

    (no need to resurrect a very old post, nellegant - better to start your own)
    It is correct that you do need to attend meetings etc on days you work. However your total directed time should not exceed 3/5 of that of a FT - ie 3/5 of 1265 hours = 759 hours.

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