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opinions please

Discussion in 'Workplace dilemmas' started by anon777, Feb 21, 2012.

  1. would it be unprofessional or illegal to wear something like this http://tinyurl.com/86lwhcs during the school day as a form of protection against students and bullying staff?

    any advice welcome

  2. Mrs_Frog

    Mrs_Frog New commenter

    Very tempting idea, but I get the impression it would be deemed unprofessional at the least. Also, not sure of the implications if any action were to be brought whether the evidence would be admissible.....
    B x
  3. Middlemarch

    Middlemarch Star commenter

    People get very sensitive indeed about being recorded without their permission and such recordings potentially being offered as incriminating evidence thereafter.
  4. Karvol

    Karvol Occasional commenter

    Do keep in mind that these fora are not a representation of the whole teaching world.
  5. Rockchick2112

    Rockchick2112 New commenter

    As others have said, I don't think you could get away with recording people without their permission. Where pupils are concerned, I don't think you would get permission to record them- however, some schools have CCTV, which would offer some degree of protection. As I said on another post recently, I think that all members of school staff should have the right to tell other staff members present at a meeting that it is being recorded- this should serve to put bullies off making intimidating remarks, but it could also serve as a useful tool to remind everyone of what was discussed (a recording could be used to write up minutes of a meeting afterwards).
  6. thank you for all your replies guy. i can see where everyone is coming from in terms of seeking permission. My school is covered in cctv and there is no singage anywhere stating that you are being recorded and for what purpose. it has been used for "catching" students up to no good and "catching" staff leaving work 2 minutes early etc (seriously). In reality i would want to have the device on record all the time. not after i had just told the bully i had started recording. if it is the case that covert recordins of staff acting unprofessionaly/ illegaly cannot be used as evidence. is it the same for students recording teachers doing the same thing? im not encouraging any unrofessional behaviour at all but the argument is still the same imho. i am totally against the big brother society but i am also totaly against false acusations and bullying by staff.
  7. Gardening Leaves

    Gardening Leaves New commenter

    As I understand it (and I am quite willing to be proved wrong) it is not illegal to make a recording of someone without their permission, just as it is not illegal to take a photograph of someone, without their permission. (How may holiday snaps do you have that contain images of other people, or videos in which strangers are speaking?)
    Recorded evidence may not be admissable in court, although there are examples where transcripts of recorded conversations being used, with the tape available for corroboration, if necessary. Old fashioned tape recordings are better than digital recordings, that can easily be altered on a computer, can they not? It is quite legitimate to argue that you are recording your own voice, with the other party being secondary, just so that your own words cannot be subsequently corrupted and used against you. Even though the evidence may not be admissable in court, it would, indeed, be powerful to be able to demonstrate that you have a recording.
    What is illegal, of course, is to tap someone's phone or hack into someone's answerphone or computer for information.
  8. Gardening Leaves

    Gardening Leaves New commenter

  9. I understand your concerns, and at times have shared them. I usually deal with this by asking that any meetings be scheduled a head of time, and I request the presence of a staff member I am more comfortable will in order to ensure protection.
    Not only does this ensure that there is a second set of ears in the room, but the act of scheduling a meetings gives everyone time to think about what they are going to say, thus avoiding regrets.

    I hope this is helpful!
  10. DaisysLot

    DaisysLot Senior commenter

    It would be illegal for you to 'record' others in such a way without seeking their explicit permission. I would seek to resolve the issues over which you keep getting cornered into having 'quiet words' in the first instance rather than posing at James Bond :)
  11. With respect Daisy, it's not illegal, as GLhas indicated. For a lawyer's opinion on the subject, see


    I quote: "Between two private individuals it is not prohibited to record conversations. The problem arises however, if that conversation is then provided to a third party for whatever reason, without the consent of both parties. Consent can be obtained retrospectively or by arguing it to be within the publics interest".
  12. Gardening Leaves

    Gardening Leaves New commenter

    Thanks for the legal source. Thats helpful.
  13. thank you for you help GL. After reading the page you just linked. i beleive that i could justify my actions are in the public interest for it to be known that valuable, taxpayer resources are being waisted bullying and harrasing members of staff.
  14. YesMrBronson

    YesMrBronson New commenter

    That's cobblers dude.
    If that were true then Heat magazine would be out of business.
  15. Gardening Leaves

    Gardening Leaves New commenter

    Tis indeed true! The problem comes if you then try to publish it. There are all kinds of regulations covering broadcasting and other media right to privacy vs public interest etc etc.

    In the case of recording per se, there does not seem to be an issue. The problem arises if you then wish ti involve a third party without gaining permission. You can be given permission to use it if what you wish to demonstrate is of sufficient seriousness that you can argue it outweighs the respect for privacy. To be able to ,tell a bully that you have a recording of a conversation ans to gI've them a transcript of it could be powerful.
  16. DaisysLot

    DaisysLot Senior commenter

    So in response to behavior one decides is bullying, one if going to record the person and bully them back with this material?
  17. daisy, had it not occured to you that the informal and formal route to resolve this matter has been exhausted? i have not come to this decision lightly. i have not decided that the behaviour is bullying. the behaviour IS bullying full stop. i am deeply offended that you claim i would be bullying them back with the material gathered. how would i be bullying them back by giving my union evidence that i am being abused myself? am i not alowed to protect my mental health from anymore abuse?. and as for acting like james bond, perhaps if people where not acting like the mafia then i would not be in need to such a drastic measure. you argument has so many holes i can see through it.
  18. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    How will you avoid breaching data protection law? Surely if you record everything all day you will sometimes record personal information about other staff and pupils?
  19. DaisysLot

    DaisysLot Senior commenter

    This is certainly an issue. I do feel there are other ways to tackle bullying and that the action you propose will result in more trouble than resolution....
  20. It is entirely lawful to record any sound at all, any conversation at all, without the need to inform any other person. It is unlawful only in instances where judicial procedings are taking place, and where matters of national security are being openly discussed.

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