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NQT Year Abroad

Discussion in 'Teaching overseas' started by ABackhouse, Oct 25, 2017.

  1. ABackhouse

    ABackhouse New commenter

    I'm thinking of doing my NQT year abroad and wondered if anyone could offer any advice? I would love to go to Kuwait or somewhere but I'm in the early stages of looking. Would I still get my NQT status after the year abroad?
    Thanks :)
  2. MissCleo

    MissCleo New commenter

    Some schools will be able to offer you to do you NQT year with them. The COBIS website has a list of schools qualified to do so, although their ability to offer this as the time may vary.
  3. Wotton

    Wotton Established commenter

  4. dumbbells66

    dumbbells66 Lead commenter

    As far as i am aware you can only do it in CORBIS schools, and then only about 5 of them. Its a very small list
  5. tigi

    tigi Occasional commenter

    I know a fair few teachers who have done it, so maybe it's not so hard. The only thing I'd say is that it may not be as supportive as in the uk (of course much of that is luck) and it maybe tougher to go back to the U.K. (should you wish to) generally I suggest just looking for a job in a good school and give it a punt. Bad things happen overseas yes, but bad things happen in the uk too.
  6. the hippo

    the hippo Lead commenter Community helper

    What, exactly, is an "NQT Year Abroad"? Could you please give us a definition, ABackhouse? Do you mean that it is possible to get a teaching job overseas for only one year? That might be a bit of a problem, as most contracts are for two years. Do you mean, ABackhouse, that your year of teaching overseas might still qualify you to teach in the UK? That might be even more of a problem, as there are very few international schools that can offer an NQT year that will be accepted in the UK as a "proper NQT year". (The few COBIS schools that do offer this might perhaps be just a little bit fussy about whom they employ.) Or do you mean that lots of headteachers in the UK will be very keen to give you a job, even after you have been wasting a year (or two) in a school system that is quite different to the one that you will find in most schools in the UK, so that you will not have the knowledge, the skills and the experience to deal with the demands of a teaching job back in Dear Old Blighty?

    Or do you teach Physics, ABackhouse?

    Yes, it is true that there are some schools in the Middle East that do give jobs to NQTs. When I was in Qatar, I did see this happen. However, the schools that made a habit of doing this were not ones that I would recommend to anyone, not even to ABackhouse.

    (If the OP were to do something called a "Search", then he or she would find a thread entitled "NQT abroad", started by MissJJJ, way back in 2008.)
  7. Jessaki

    Jessaki Occasional commenter

    This question crops up so many times and my answer would always be the same: do your NQT year in the UK.
    International schools expect you to know what you are doing and expect you to do it well. The first year of teaching is very daunting and being in a position where you have guidance, extra CPD, mentoring and support is invaluable. I know some NQTs have bad experiences, but some have good one, and some have excellent experiences. I would never have jumped into international schools without having completed my induction year. It may also prove harder to come back to the UK if you have done your NQT year abroad.

    The British School system is tough and there is a lot of pointless paperwork and monitoring, this is why I left. But what I learned about differentiation, behaviour management, effective (fast) marking, handling difficult parents, supporting students with SEN, I would never have learned (in the same way) in an international setting. The kids are different and not necessarily easier. Experience is the most important thing and I would always recommend that before venturing into international teaching.

    There are schools that accept NQTs and some which offer the Induction, but it wont be the same. What is very beneficial being an NQT in the UK is you will be surrounded by other NQTs, with whom you can discuss and share experiences. It helps keep you sane! You will not have that if you go abroad.

    Kuwait will still be there next year.
    Alice K and blueskydreaming like this.
  8. the hippo

    the hippo Lead commenter Community helper

    Well, Jessaki, quite a lot of NQTs in the UK do not seem to be very happy. If you trawl through the NQT forum on this website, you will find plenty of horror stories. The drop-out rate for NQTs is simply awful and it tells you all you need to know about how blooming dreadful it is for many NQTs.

    During my years in Qatar, I met several NQTs who said that they could not get teaching jobs in the UK, so their only option was to get a job overseas. As for your emphatic statement that experience is the "most important thing", Jessaki, I would suggest that for many NQTs who are leaving university with student debts, money might perhaps be a little bit important. And how much money will you have if you are an NQT in the UK, paying Council Tax and rent and at the same time trying to pay off your student loan? Could you give us some figures, please? Do you think that most NQTs could easily save up the deposit for an apartment or a house?

    I do not go back on what I have written, on many occasions, namely that going overseas as an NQT has its dangers. There certainly are some scummy "international" schools. However, Jessaki, you have already admitted that the British system is "tough" and that there is "a lot of pointless paperwork". Well, if it is so horrible, why stay in the UK? In many ways I do empathize with NQTs who want to get out sooner rather than later. Having been in international education since 1998, lots of international teachers have said to me, "I will never go back to teaching in the UK. It is absolutely ghastly!" I have never heard even one say, "Oh, teaching in the UK is so much better than teaching in any international school. I made a big mistake in leaving the UK." Yes, some do go back for personal or family reasons, but many more keep leaving.

    Of course things are usually much easier if you teach Physics, so let us all hope that ABackhouse is up to scratch on his (or her) Quantum Mechanics.
  9. february31st

    february31st Established commenter

    Again I would recommend any newly qualfied teacher to complete their induction year in the UK.

    I have found to my benefit having a bit of paper and a name on a database invaluable. Many claim to be teachers in international teaching, but can not show any qualification to prove it.

    I have found visa, mortgage and bsnk loans easy once i can prove I am a fully registered UK teacher.

    Many teachers I know who have not completed their NQT are stuck in no mans land. For various reasons they can not or do not want to return to England and complete their NQT. This in the eyes of the law means they are not fully qualified and with the visa requirements in China been increased this may cause their next work visa renewal to be rejected.

    If you read the small print in the China visa regulations it does say application by teachers requires tjem to be fully qualified in the country their Degree/Teaching qualification was issued.
  10. the hippo

    the hippo Lead commenter Community helper

  11. blueskydreaming

    blueskydreaming Lead commenter

    I agree with you, and @Jessaki - I would suggest making it through the NQT year in the UK simply because if you do not complete your NQT year you will have issues if you ever do end up returning to the UK to work as a teacher.

    Now, while some people on the forum may lack the imagination to conjure up some ideas as to why a person may have to return to the UK, even for a short time, here are some: ill health of a loved one, ill health of self, change in life circumstances (divorce, baby, death of a family member or loved one), simply missing family and friends... Those reading this may be childless or parentless, but surely can appreciate that many people are not. Living abroad has certainly made me appreciate my family more, especially as several deaths and illnesses have been experienced during that time.

    I will just point out though that NQT induction has nothing to do with being fully qualified in the country where your degree/qualification was issued - NQT induction is only required to teach in state schools in the UK, not independents or other types of school. As there are no British state schools in China they should not demand that you have passed the NQT induction before working here (although they don't follow logic in this country, and do not understand our educational system, so anything is possible). You only need your QTS number to prove that you are a fully registered/qualified teacher - the number is given to you when you start teacher training, and you are given QTS (qualified teacher status) when your PGCE ends, not after completing the NQT year.

    Another point: my department at my school in China is a complete mess, and is run by people who are not qualified and do not understand the British education system. Had I known this, I would not have accepted the job; but hindsight is 20/20 and I'm going to have to try and make the best of it. My subject is not considered important in the school, and as the school is selective there are some very bright kids who are able to succeed despite the limitations of the staff, which are the only reasons the department is able to get away with being like this. I am thankful for my previous 2 years in the UK post-qualification, because if I had walked into my current school immediately after the PGCE it would have been detrimental to my development as a teacher. So, let's not presume that all schools overseas are better than those in the UK, shall we :)
    Alice K likes this.
  12. february31st

    february31st Established commenter

    In the Uk only teachers who have QTS and completed a NQT/Probationary or Induction year are regarded as been fully qualified. This is without going into those teachers licenced by tbe Secretary of State for Education.

    I wish people would read the Education Reform Act! Just because you may work in the private sector, Free Schools and Academies as a teacher without QTS or passing your NQT doesnt make you a qualified teacher.

    I would have been unable to obtain my mortgage for my appartment in Shanghai without my letter from the DFE after completing my probation. That one little letter has allowed me to secure a million pound profit on paper.(at an exchange rate of 8.5rmb to the pound).
  13. dumbbells66

    dumbbells66 Lead commenter

    I worked in UK state schools perfectly well for years without my NQT, and i have never been asked if i had done my "NQT" when applying for anything financial. My records on the offical government wedsite state "qualified teacher states gained". I have NO issue with calling myself a FULLY QUALLIFIED TEACHER. I would also like to point out, not one intetnational school i have ever worked at, or ever applied to has EVER asked about my NQT status. They ask for my degree that states i have "qualified teacher status". I have also had a number of conversations with directors of schools, and principles and the vast majority of them have no idea what an NQT year is...this maybe because they have not been British.

    I really think you are over stating the value of this little piece of paper....but i do agree the support and experience you get from doing it would be valuable...but not required.
  14. blueskydreaming

    blueskydreaming Lead commenter

    Several Education Acts have replaced the Education Reform Act.

    https://www.education.gov.uk/consultations/downloadableDocs/Statutory guidance for the induction of NQTs (England) - Consultation Draft (v2).pdf - see section 1.1 'Purpose of induction 1.1 Statutory induction is the bridge between initial teacher training and a career in teaching. It combines a personalised programme of development, support and professional dialogue with monitoring and an assessment of performance against the relevant standards (see para 1.5). The programme should support the newly qualified teacher (NQT) to meet the relevant standards by the end of the period and equip them with the tools to be an effective and successful teacher.' --- Why doesn't it say that the purpose of induction is to qualify you to teach? Because once you have QTS you are qualified, that is why.

    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/qualified-teacher-status-qts - '
    You must have qualified teacher status (QTS) to take up a teaching post in England in a:

    • maintained primary school
    • maintained secondary school
    • maintained special school
    • non-maintained special school
    Maintained schools form part of the state-funded schools system in England (including primary, secondary and special schools for pupils with special educational needs). In maintained schools funding and oversight is generally through the local authority. They make up the majority of schools in England and are mostly either community schools or voluntary controlled schools (where the local authority employs the school’s staff and is responsible for admissions) or foundation and voluntary aided schools, where the school’s governing body employs the staff and has responsibility for admissions.

    The National College for Teaching and Leadership (NCTL) is the competent authority in England for the teaching profession. On behalf of the Secretary of State we’re responsible for the award of QTS. We also award QTS to trained teachers from the European Economic Area (EEA).
    dumbbells66 likes this.
  15. drvs

    drvs Star commenter

    That's not something you see every day.
    dumbbells66 likes this.
  16. dumbbells66

    dumbbells66 Lead commenter

    I would love to know how the conversation went with the Bank in China @february31st ?
    "So, i see you have your degree here, but Mr February i MUST have your NQT certificate to varify that you are actaully a teacher. Im sorry but i cant proceed ypur apllication without it"....was thats what happened ?????;)
  17. blueskydreaming

    blueskydreaming Lead commenter

    Good job he didn't complete his PGCE prior to 1999, otherwise there would be no NQT certificate to show! Try explaining that one to the bank in China! My bank in China couldn't get my name right on my account, even though they were copying it off my passport, so not sure they'd understand the requirements of teacher training in England.
    dumbbells66 likes this.
  18. ejclibrarian

    ejclibrarian Established commenter Community helper

  19. dumbbells66

    dumbbells66 Lead commenter

    Has musikteech just lost another username?????o_O
  20. Shimazu2

    Shimazu2 New commenter

    What about when references are being collected? You'd have to have a current headteacher as one, I would advise against this..

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