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No, we were not being lied to over Salisbury. So what happens now?

Discussion in 'Personal' started by nomad, Sep 5, 2018.

  1. nomad

    nomad Star commenter

    Now, it seems, we can put behind us all that russophilic bluff and bluster from Corbyn, those ridiculous links from posters to Craig Murray's conspiracy theorist blog site, those silly suggestions that the whole tragic issue was a fabrication by the Tory government to detract from "all that is going wrong with this country" and face up to the facts that once again there has been an assassination attempt by Russian operatives on British soil.

    Fortunately the attack on the intended victim(s), in this case, was unsuccessful. However, one unsuspecting victim, Dawn Sturgess, has been murdered.

    The Russian state denies involvement, but then it would. As indeed it did in the Litvienko murder and the Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 tragedy, passing the accusations off as 'smears'.

    What action should Britain and the rest of the sensible world take?

    The two perpetrators, using the names Alexander Petrov and Ruslan Boshirov, are the subject of European Arrest Warrants. There is no extradition agreement with Russia.
    woollani and Brunel like this.
  2. emerald52

    emerald52 Star commenter

    Actions will be covert so as not to ramp up tension anymore.
    Bedlam3 and nomad like this.
  3. red_observer

    red_observer Star commenter

    I think those of us who were cautious but not dismissive were right to be. This looks a bit more definitive though and of course hideous and wrong. By it they will probably never be brought to justice.
    JosieWhitehead likes this.
  4. racroesus

    racroesus Star commenter

    All this agreement breaking out. We should have a vote on Brexit.
  5. koopatroopa

    koopatroopa Senior commenter

    To give the Russians something to do?
    racroesus likes this.
  6. red_observer

    red_observer Star commenter

    I still find it hard to believe why Putin would sanction it. It’s probably rogue elements in the GRU. But it’s certainly a development!
  7. nomad

    nomad Star commenter

    Cautious is fine by me @red_observer. Cautious but not dismissive is fine too. Always has been.

    What really pi55ed me off, on reading through every post in the previous Salisbury thread this afternoon, was the multitude of posts which overtly blamed Porton Down, hinted at Tory government involvement and linked to screaming loonies like Craig Murray as 'proof' of alternative 'truths'.

    As to being brought to justice, it would not surprise me at all if the two perpetrators, whatever their real names may be, are already at the bottom of the Moskva River wearing concrete shoes courtesy of the GRU. Why risk future political embarrassment by allowing the possibility of them spilling their stories to MI6?
  8. red_observer

    red_observer Star commenter

    Good post. As I said I think Putin is t involved himself but rogue elements. I think that’s what I’m coming round to now @nomad
    nomad likes this.
  9. oldsomeman

    oldsomeman Star commenter

    Today on Radio 4 one expert based in russia still believed the the sanctions for the attack must have come from the kremlin itself and the GRU are not allowwed to carry out such a politically delicate area
    By the same token another says that the Russians, by using nerve agent only they use, wanted us to know how powerful they are by using it in our country,thats the use was part of power politics not rougue forces.Ie it was planned and executed as a way o warning out government.
    There is little chance the agents will be found.
    Its interesting that the man poisoned had in fact been talking to several East Europen countries. sharing his experience of how their spy network operated. So the actions could also have been a warning message to any other ex spies to stay quiet or risk the long arm of Russia to trace and kill them.
  10. smoothnewt

    smoothnewt Star commenter

    An interesting possibility, but I heard earlier on TV that those responsible for the Litvinenko murder have actually become celebrities in Russia, feted for their derring-do. Different circumstances, but the same intent. It will be interesting to see what happens.
  11. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    The accused are innocent until they are proven guilty.
  12. artboyusa

    artboyusa Star commenter

    Rogue elements? There are no rogue elements. Those people go where they're told and do what they're told or otherwise they don't live very long.
  13. Brunel

    Brunel Lead commenter

    A meaningless comment as the Russians will not allow any suspects to be extradited.
    It has been a constant source of astonishment the lengths to which some people have been prepared to go to exonerate the Russian government. It’s very unlikely that ‘rogue elements’ were responsible and very likely that the order to assassinate the Skripals came from the top. Why? Because sadly, it’s how the government still deals with those perceived to be enemies of the state. It’s not hard for example to find out out how many investigative journalists have been murdered in Russia while Putin has been President ( well over 100 in his first two terms alone) though it is much harder to find examples of their murderers being successfully prosecuted.

    You would imagine that the fact that so much evidence has been collected that points to Russian involvement in the Skripals’ poisoning might deter the Russians from repeating a similar action. But then a similar amount of evidence was gathered to prove Russian involvement in the Litvinenko murder and that didn’t have a deterrent effect. Certainly the British government should be more proactive than it was after the Litvinenko murder in dealing with this flagrant breach of international law. Sadly however, as long as the mafia state still has so many useful idiots in the west the story of the Skripals is unlikely to be a final chapter.
  14. nomad

    nomad Star commenter

    They are only useful idiots through their blind acolyte worship of Corbyn as some sort of evangelical messiah.

    For some strange reason their membership of Momentum, their inane posting of #wearecorbyn and moronic chanting of "Oh Jeremy Corbyn" appears to have taken away their ability to reason anything logically, coupled with their dependence on fringe media alt-left blog sites for 'news'.

    Whatever Corbyn believes, they believe.
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2018
  15. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    No. The presumption of innocence is sacrosanct. To deny this is to be an enemy of justice.
    racroesus likes this.
  16. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    You say this but:

  17. Aquamarina1234

    Aquamarina1234 Star commenter

    Wtcluck else could possibly have been to blame? Is this a fairytale? Godsteeth, HELLO? I have no clue why, but reasons surely to betsy are Russian-related.
    Now, not to say all Russians are... whovah. Or all Corbynistas are... that. Or anyone else much cares. BUT really? I need to know why Russians of any persuasion send agents here to murder ex people and then dispose of murder agent so poorly, another person has to dIe.
  18. nomad

    nomad Star commenter

    "Deaf, blind and devoid of common sense the Corbynistas have become. The Force is not with them"
  19. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    'Execute order 66.'

    nomad likes this.
  20. vinnie24

    vinnie24 Lead commenter

    Where did you hear this? Sounds interesting. Any articles for us to peruse?

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