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NASUWT says 68,000 BME teachers needed.

Discussion in 'Education news' started by Mr_Ed, Jul 13, 2017.

  1. Smithy84

    Smithy84 New commenter

    Thank you for clarifying your position. That's all anyone needs to know about you.
  2. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter

    Anyone who dares disagree with you is a racist? How pathetic. Have you tried counselling?
  3. vinnie24

    vinnie24 Lead commenter

    If I was arguing for segregation I would have said white kids should only have white teachers and black kids should only have black teachers and they should be educated in separate schools.

    Maybe you don't understand what segregation is.
  4. blazer

    blazer Star commenter

    You have hair, lucky you! At least you won't suffer from baldism.
    wanet likes this.
  5. tackles

    tackles Occasional commenter

    I'm curious as to why there is this apparent shortfall in BME teachers, it can't all be down to perceived racism.

    Other careers seem to have far more BME members - medicine, sport etc. Is it to do with the perception of the education sector as a whole? There's a split between the idea that teachers are all work-shy layabouts who only work 6 hours a day and have a quarter of the year off in holidays, and the idea that teaching is a thankless job where you're subject to scrutiny and abuse with no obvious protection.

    None of my BME friends have gone into teaching, they are all well paid and high achieving professionals. Frankly, they think teaching is a mug's game.

    Of course, teaching isn't the only career with low BME participation, farming is another one. Wilfred Emmanuel-Jones has built his brand on his ethnicity and has set up a scheme to encourage more BME farmers, but the numbers still remain low.

    I suspect farming, like teaching, has a poor public image and this may account for some of the discrepancy.
  6. Smithy84

    Smithy84 New commenter

    You won't understand because you are the problem. You are living in this white prvilige bubble.

    If we disagreed on football, that doesn't mean your racist. However when you casually brush aside the concerns thousands of BME teachers because you feel like it dont you realise the impact you're having? These marginalised groups have suffered clear racism and are shouting out for help and your response is "meh". How different is that to the BNP thug calling someone a n****er?

    Looking at your post history, it's quite easy to see who has nothing better to do with their time.
    MonMothma likes this.
  7. MonMothma

    MonMothma Lead commenter

    I think your posts on this thread and your attitude towards people with REAL experience of everyday racism speaks volumes. I've not experienced your views on sexism and feminism but I have this suspicion you'll probably dismiss women's experiences of sexism as well. Or ask them to speak nicely about it.
  8. MonMothma

    MonMothma Lead commenter

    Oh - and I didn't post the pictures you posted. That says enough about you.
  9. MonMothma

    MonMothma Lead commenter

    He - and others on here - doesn't realise the impact they have. I do wonder how many are watching and get the Handmaid's tale. It's about women's rights but it's far far far more than that. It's about power and brushing aside concerns because they don't affect you. Until they do.
    Smithy84 likes this.
  10. Landofla

    Landofla Established commenter

    OP, I hope that you, like I, wish for a day when colour isn't seen and there isn't a need for a certain number of any colour to be employed. I would hate to get the job because I am the desired colour.
    wanet likes this.
  11. Smithy84

    Smithy84 New commenter

  12. vinnie24

    vinnie24 Lead commenter

    I think you would hate more not getting a job because you are the wrong colour.
    Smithy84 likes this.
  13. MonMothma

    MonMothma Lead commenter

    It's interesting to see how Parliament has changed with all women shortlists. As Parliament becomes more female, hopefully that encourages other women to stand as MP and then it becomes 'normal' to see female MPs. Despite all the mysogyny and sexism in Parliament.

    Subconscious 'isms' are hard to combat. But they definitely happen. I wonder how many people on here will experience 'ageism'. I wonder how many people on here have dismissed 'ageism' as a thing?
  14. Landofla

    Landofla Established commenter

    @Smithy84 I can see how this upsets you. You shouldn't make assumptions about someone you don't know. I have my own experiences of attacks based on colour and race and prefer not to discuss them here. What I do wish to discuss is positivity; I never focus on the negatives.

    @vinnie24 which has happened. My gender is more important though. I have also not gotten jobs and raises because of my gender. However, I prefer to focus on positivity.

    Weed the racists out and then employing quotas won't be necessary.
    Smithy84 and Moony like this.
  15. drek

    drek Star commenter

    Comparing performance management with other jobs, teaching capability decisions are based totally on subjective opinions and on many occasions by those who would not be able to teach under the workload conditions they impose on others!
    This can increase the barriers to entering or pursuing the profession (or rather -job) for many, not just people of a different race or ethnicity.

    Nowadays I rarely see classroom teachers above the age of 48 or so.....

    Yet the pension age has risen.........

    The chalkface female to male ratio is still high in many schools.

    Is it because female teachers in general tend to be yes people (with martyrish dispositions) and are perhaps more compliant, making it easier to impose sweeping policy changes without raising more than a murmur of discontent from a minority?
    Smithy84 likes this.
  16. Smithy84

    Smithy84 New commenter

    These are some valid concerns even though they aren't related to this thread.:cool:
  17. Mr_Ed

    Mr_Ed Established commenter

    During my time in teaching, almost twenty years now, I have twice been on the receiving end of workplace bullying, I have once had a job offer withdrawn in strange circumstances (I'd been on maternity cover and had been promised another role - which at the eleventh hour, didn't materialise). I feel I have suffered from ageism at interview - or rather costism due to being more expensive than the other (NQT) candidates. Furthermore, in recent years I have found myself minutely compared to my peers, sometimes favourably, sometimes not, because of how my student outcomes have looked on some giant Excel spreadsheet. Finally, I have fallen out with several colleagues, over what can only be described as a 'clash of personalities' leading to much strain in the workplace. Judging by these forums, especially workplace dilemmas, I'm not alone.

    Now, in every one of these situations, that I briefly mentioned, the problems have been with people of the same race, as myself. So when I had to reflect on whether I was at fault, or in the right, race did not come into it.

    Is it not possible, that when any of these things happen and the parties involved are from diverse backgrounds, that the first thought of the person under criticism could be "is it my skin colour"? When in fact, it's just how teaching is, especially now, where the only way to get a significant salary increase is to climb the greasy pole & that sometimes means playing the politics game.

    When I first entered this profession, we spent a relaxed lunch hour in the staffroom, chatting about news, politics, culture, football etc. Monday through Thursday (on Friday, we did the same, but down at the pub). As colleagues entered their last few years before retirement, their duties were reduced whilst they continued to receive management point increments for things such as 'NQT mentoring' or indeed in my first school 'Exam Administration' (We had an official exams officer, so the 'admin’ role was basically to make sure there were enough chairs and tables in the gym, through May & June). Nowadays everything is well, more business-like, no 'coasting' allowed.

    So, Smithy84, I don't think as you do that "...the entire teaching system is institutionally racist.......". But what I will say is this: education has become a much nastier working environment, full stop, where racial issues are a small part of a much bigger problem & which under continued austerity measures will probably only get worse and worse.
    drek likes this.
  18. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter

    So you argue that ethnic minority pupils should be taught by ethnic minority teachers but don't think you're arguing for segregation... even though that's exactly what you are arguing for...

    I clearly have a better idea of segregation than you do... this thread is very illuminating of the neo-racist attitudes now proving acceptable among those of a receptive mindset.
    Landofla, FrankWolley and Mr_Ed like this.
  19. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter

    He's casually brushing aside your views ... you don't speak for ''thousands of BME teachers''... stop pretending you do.
    Laphroig likes this.
  20. vinnie24

    vinnie24 Lead commenter

    The NASUWT say 68000 BME teachers are needed (title of thread). This is to reflect the school population of students. In other words not only should students (black, white and brown (is that better?)) have white teachers they should have black and brown teachers as well. This is not unreasonable surely. We do live in a multicultural society after all.

    For further clarity my position is the same as the NASUWT. You're not accusing them of promoting segregation are you? Seems to me to be the exact opposite.

    As I said earlier, judging by your comments I get the impression that you don't really know what segregation is.

    These might help



    Good luck

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