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Discussion in 'Education news' started by rwhg, Mar 22, 2020.

  1. rwhg

    rwhg New commenter

    Like most of us, if it were just me I had to worry about I'd be "happy" to be in school tomorrow. But I am a single father, and care for my kids twice a week. They both have asthma and take daily steroid inhalers and tablets, my son having contracted pneumonia last year.

    Where do I stand regarding my right to protect my children from CV19 by isolating myself from the school community to protect them. My school has told us all to come in on Monday and Tuesday and they'll sort it out from there, but having had an informal (and slightly heated) conversation with the Deputy head AFTER I had emailed her raising my concerns (who said "My son could catch a cough at nursery tomorrow!!", so possible doesn't understand the situation) and having emailed the head raising concerns about the schools bullish and naive attitude towards the virus, I would like to know if I can say I am not coming in! Schools across the world seem to be properly shut, not this Shut-Lite that we are forced into, and I don't want to put my loved ones at risk whilst we wait for the s*** to hit the fan.
    agathamorse and BetterNow like this.
  2. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    Can you contact your union?
    Morninglover and agathamorse like this.
  3. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    Can you not see your children for a few months?
  4. rwhg

    rwhg New commenter

    Corvuscorax, you either have an extremely ironic sense of humour or are ******* ********

    My Union's advice

    Currently, in accordance with Government advice, individuals who live in a household with a vulnerable person may reasonably be expected to attend work as directed by their employer.

    If neither the carer nor the individual receiving care is symptomatic, the Government advice is that no additional measures are required above and beyond normal good hygiene practices
    Rosiehns and agathamorse like this.
  5. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    what is wrong with that suggestion? You say you only care for them twice a week. So don't see the for the duration of this crisis. That is not an unusual suggestion or solution. Many teachers families have been split up in recent weeks, including my own. Several of my colleagues have moved out from their families, so their families can keep themselves safe. I don't know enough about your children's situation to know if they can stay away from you for a couple of months, but its working out for thousands of other families. Its at least worth considering
  6. rwhg

    rwhg New commenter

    Well your colleagues are probably ******* ******** as well then because if they are symptomatic then their whole families should be self-isolating for 14 days! You just suggested I don't see my kids for a few months... so what 100 days? 200?
  7. Morninglover

    Morninglover Star commenter

    And would your children's mother be fine about that?
  8. diddydave

    diddydave Established commenter

    To protect your children your choices appear to be:

    1) Isolate yourself completely so on the 2 days a week you do see them you don't have a virus to pass on to them.
    2) Isolate them from yourself by not having them for 2 days a week if you can be sure the person who does have them for those 2 days doesn't have the virus.

    The guidance doesn't help you with either of these as any way you look at it the guidance says you should go to work.
  9. drek

    drek Star commenter

    It is stressful and we can understand your anxiety, but It is no good asking on this website.
    Nobody on here is a coronavirus expert. Go to gov.uk and search for coronavirus guidance for schools/educational providers

    Most schools were advised by govt via councils to ask all staff except those in vulnerable groups to come in on monday.

    I think sensible SLT teams will know the numbers of children of key workers and children in care by now or wait for kids to turn up on monday and verify numbers.
    I'm guessing schools will vary in number from 2 to around 100 depending on area.
    They will then probably ask teachers to come in on a rota basis in order to comply with social distancing as much as possible.
    Probably 1 adult to 5 - 10 students?
    In which case they will want everyone in so they can plan upto easter at least.
    If you go in on monday with fewer students you should be able to maintain a safe distance apart?
    You could then tell them the days you are available.
    Remember this is a stressful time for everyone and your school will be sticking to government guidelines which updates almost every hour!
    I would send emails rather than speaking face to face to avoid asking questions to which they dont have answers yet.

    Also copy relevant links from gov.uk website to back up your questions/requests because they will be getting lots of questions from worried staff.
    simonCOAL likes this.
  10. rwhg

    rwhg New commenter

    Thanks for the inputs, my apologies for being confrontational; it's already hard enough only seeing my kids 2 days a week, without it being suggested that I don't see them at all for months. My family is the only thing that keeps my head above water sometimes, and asking me to sacrifice that for other people's families is a big ask .

    I will try again with the emails, but my head can be a "lets not put this in an email" kind of person.
    keggle likes this.
  11. crumbleskates

    crumbleskates Occasional commenter

    We have tried to put parents with vulnerable family members in the working from home bracket who are doing all the online work.
    Horrified that some schools are letting children just turn up. We asked for an application form, and what times/ days they need. All have done this and we have also asked one or two if their partner can do some. Numbers are now much more manageable. Staff on a rota. Parents have been fantastically supportive and grateful.
    agathamorse likes this.
  12. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    I don't think you understand the situation.

    Teachers who have been and will continue to work in schools have moved out of their family homes.

    This is so they don't infect anyone at home accidentally. It might be because someone at home is particularly vulnerable, or just as general safety measure.

    This is happening all over the country.

    The teacher is then free to teach, while the family is free to practice socail distancing to a greater degree and more effectively than they could if they had a teacher coming home to them every day.

    I returned to school this week, it will be months before I see my family now, although I did face time them this evening for an hour.

    You came on here, asking how to protect your children, whom you see twice a week, and who sound vulnerable, as a working teacher.

    To me the safest and most straight forward answer is simply don't see them twice a week. Problem solved.

    You say you have to go into work, but you don't want to put loved ones at risk, so separate yourself from them, then you won't be putting them at risk.

    No one likes it, but it is what is necessary for many people right now.

    And you only see them twice a week anyway, so logistically, is not particularly difficult or disruptive to change that to 0. Not like people living with such relatives full time, who have moved out of their home, or sent relatives away.

    There is no need to be unpleasant. You asked what to do. I'm pointing out what to do. You don't like it. no one likes it, but it is what it is.

    I would be very surprised if a school gave a member of staff full time leave of absence just because they want to carry on seeing vulnerable relatives twice a week. It would be different if you were their main carer, 7 days a week, but you are not.
  13. Morninglover

    Morninglover Star commenter

    Really? How come there's been little publicity about this? (Actually none I've seen). Where are they living? If they have to pay rent, are the schools reimbursing them?
  14. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    Seriously? Teachers have left their families? Where have they gone to to live? Are they living in schools?

    How many do you know who have done that? I've not heard of any and no other poster on here has reported it.
    Morninglover and agathamorse like this.
  15. rwhg

    rwhg New commenter

    Corvuscorax, your comments are deeply alarming and are the pinnacle of the problem we have in this profession of a few people who take it upon themselves to set an impossibly high bar for the rest of us.

    "And you only see them twice a week anyway, so logistically, is not particularly difficult or disruptive to change that to 0." Wow. These are my children you are talking about, not visits to the pub.

    Was it you who suggested the social distancing, or your family?
    Morninglover likes this.
  16. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    In my school,

    1 man has moved out from his family into the spare room of another teacher., leaving wife and children - wife is immunocompromised

    1 man has moved in with his brother, while brothers wife and children have moved in with teachers wife and daughter.

    2 younger teachers have moved out of parents houses, into B and B, one because of parents, one because of vulnerable younger sibling.

    So 4 others, that I know of in my school - I expect there is more, there have been a lot of suitcases around.

    I think quite a lot of NHS staff are doing similar.

    Its voluntary though, if you live with someone vulnerable, you can just not go in to school - but that would be live with, I wouldn't expect my school to excuse someone because they want to see a relative twice a week, which is what this thread is about
  17. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    nothing to do with the demands of the profession, and everything to do with doing what is reasonable during a national emergency

    so protect them by not seeing them, as I am doing, and as others are doing. People are dying around here. We are not talking about some minor inconvenience like can't find matching shoe laces. It will take sacrifices to get through.

    It was a joint decision between all adults, and no one under 18 had a say - this was quite deliberate, so that if it goes wrong, for example, a teenager accidentally infects an adult they have been sent to, or if something happens to me when there is nobody here to help, then the youngsters will know that they had no responsibility at all for the decision.
  18. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    Of course, @rwhg, do your own thing. Its up to you, isn't it. But I am quite surprised, if you are fit and healthy yourself, that you are considering abandoning your school to see your children twice a week, or risking your children to stay in your school, when both situations are avoided by not seeing your children for a while.
  19. simonCOAL

    simonCOAL Occasional commenter

    The first paragraph of this post says it all. Wisest advice here. Well done @drek
    lizziescat and MsOnline like this.
  20. MsOnline

    MsOnline Occasional commenter

    To the OP,

    hope you've not been too upset but drek is right. Some forum members will not offer any sympathy, especially at a time of such uncertainty and stress. Let's be nice to each other.

    Let's face it, some teachers will just phone in sick to protect themselves and their own children and families. Others will feel duty bound to go into work.

    I hope it works out for you.
    agathamorse and lizziescat like this.

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