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My child my choice

Discussion in 'Education news' started by moscowbore, Jun 7, 2019.

  1. moscowbore

    moscowbore Senior commenter

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-48545247

    There is a picture of a Muslim lady holding a banner saying , "My child, my choice".

    I was unaware that parents get to choose which parts of the curriculum they will allow to be taught to their children.

    My understanding is that they send their children to a school and all children in the school experience the same curriculum. If the parent does not like the curriculum, they find another school for their children.

    My understanding is that the children are not taught about how gay and lesbian people have sex. They are taught that same sex relationships exist. That is it.

    It appears that some people , even today, refuse to acknowledge that gay relationships exist. Astonishing!
     
  2. Lalex123

    Lalex123 Occasional commenter

    I appreciate that schools need to be continually challenged and parents should question the curriculum to ensure it is robust and suitable for their child, but surely common sense dictates that teaching students about a variety of beliefs, relationships and opinions will help create tolerance, acceptance and understanding...
     
  3. neddyfonk

    neddyfonk Established commenter

    "My child my choice" is restricted by the laws and standards that apply in the country you decide to live in. Maybe they could move to Russia for the stance on homosexuality they seek. Better still, abandon stupid religions. I certainly would not relocate to 90% of the countries in the world.
     
  4. sabram86

    sabram86 Occasional commenter

    In all honesty, the Muslim lady is right.

    What right do schools have to impose their morals? The state is an amoral thing whose only proper purpose is to protect life and property. The state, whether in Parliament or otherwise, cannot make moral judgements.

    The more schools are run like churches, the more such reactions can be expected.
     
  5. Josh7

    Josh7 Occasional commenter


    Does that not include the lives of homosexuals?
     
    jlishman2158 and Missbubbleblue like this.
  6. sabram86

    sabram86 Occasional commenter

    Of course, but that simply means that there are laws against harming people and property. The judgements to be made of any mode of life - whether religion or personal lifestyle - is not and cannot be a state matter. The use of state power to police thought and speech is always wrong.
     
  7. moscowbore

    moscowbore Senior commenter

    This is a dangerous standpoint.

    Some Muslims believe that the only music which is halal is vocal music. Would you be happy for Muslim parents to refuse to allow their children to attend music lessons because instruments were being used? The teaching of probabilities using dice could be considered to be teaching gambling. Where would it end?
     
  8. schoolsout4summer

    schoolsout4summer Star commenter

    On this subject, I'm with the legendary Bob Hope. He was once being interviewed at Heathrow Airport, on his way back to the USA after visiting Britain. He said "I understand that you've just legalised homosexuality. I'm getting out before you make it compulsory".
    I'm also sympathetic to Ian McShane's observation to Dame Edna Everage, that "waving it in your face and trying to ram it down your throat can leave a nasty taste in your mouth".
    Perhaps this lifestyle choice is best ignored, rather than being inadvertently promoted by those with a closeted agenda. The last thing that educators should be doing is promoting this particular lifestyle choice to impressionable children as being as normal as going into McDonald's and choosing between a Big Mack or a Fillet 'O Fish.
    How can you decide if you haven't tried it first?
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2019
  9. sabram86

    sabram86 Occasional commenter

    That's reductio ad absurdum. Little harm, if any, is caused by refusing either of these things. Schools rarely teach music well anyway.

    All that needs to be taught is that people have rights to the protection of life and property and to freedom. Their judgements about homosexuality and Islam are not a state matter.
     
  10. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    There are laws against hate crime...do you object to them? If you do, then it's up to you to start a political campaign to allow racism, homophobia etc. Good luck with that...;) (Not!)

    If you accept that those laws are good, and indeed necessary, then you must allow schools to help prepare pupils for living in the society that has such laws, especially children of parents who don't support such laws. Just as schools teach about drug use/misuse, even to pupils whose parents perhaps are regular illegal drug users. Isn't that right?

    Indeed I'd go further - parents who say (for example) that homosexuality is evil/wrong are abusing their children and the children should be taken into care to protect them.
     
  11. aypi

    aypi Established commenter

    This thread illustrates why the school is correct, there are plenty of teachers who need to attend the lessons offered.
     
  12. sabram86

    sabram86 Occasional commenter

    As it happens, I do object to hate speech laws, because they allow the likes of Tommy Robinson and Nick Griffin to pose as victims. They also make their opponents lazy because they do not feel the need to debate with them. That might explain why the Labour Party is mired in anti-Semitism.

    You've still not dealt with my central point - the State cannot make moral judgements. What it churns out is propaganda that serves its own interests.

    As for drugs? Legalise them all.
     
  13. Bond231

    Bond231 New commenter

    I fully believe schools should be teaching children about the wide range of people they shall meet in life.

    My biggest gripe about this subject is that a minority group who crave tolerance and acceptance are so intolerable and unaccepting of others. I shall never understand that!
     
  14. sabram86

    sabram86 Occasional commenter

    Are they being intolerant? Tolerance does not require you to accept people into your home whose ideas you reject. You allow them their rights and liberty; you expect the same in return.

    Tolerance does not mean that you have no rights to your own views and to acting on them in your own life, provided that you do no real harm to others.
     
  15. dunnocks

    dunnocks Star commenter


    its very common for Muslim parents to refuse to allow this, in my experience


    and actually, I do think it is harmful
     
  16. Bond231

    Bond231 New commenter

    So would you agree with parents standing outside schools protesting that children are learning about Muslims? Or if they were protesting about children learning about single parents families existing?

    They are doing real harm to others - the protests will have caused significant psychological damage to teachers, parents and children. Children who now have it ingrained into them that if they are ‘different’ they are wrong, disgusting, unworthy humans.

    I’m afriad I shall never agree with your view point - it’s narrow and is one of the reasons I am glad this country has strict laws on racism and homophobia.
     
  17. harsh-but-fair

    harsh-but-fair Star commenter

    OMG
     
  18. aypi

    aypi Established commenter

    I have difficulty even with the term "Moral judgement"
    There is nothing empirical about it. It is prejudice judgement.
    The state has the right to end prejudice.
     
  19. harsh-but-fair

    harsh-but-fair Star commenter

    Oh and I meant to add - I'm glad you didn't teach my children.
     
  20. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    And abolish all laws? Schools after all also socialise pupils not to commit all sorts of crime.

    As for Robinson & Griffin - they are not the targets of hate crime legislation, it is those nasty pieced of excrement who actually follow them and are keen to whip up hatred against minorities.
     

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