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Music technology suite not working out

Discussion in 'Music' started by jerunder, Sep 15, 2011.

  1. Hi all - I am quite desperate so would really appreciate some input!

    We purchased 15 focusrite saffire 6 audio interfaces, MIDI keyboards and Sibelius 6 to use in a windows 7 based computer classroom with my new GCSE music course. The keyboards came bundled with Ableton live lite 8, as do the saffire 6. Next year we'll have the money to purchase protools 9 which will work with these audio interfaces, but the bundled Ableton should do us fine for now, or so I thought...

    None of this except Sibelius is in any way functional as the audio interface drivers, MIDI keyboard drivers and Ableton are not recognised when logged in as student or teacher, they only work with network manager's admin login. Plugging one of these devices in with a student or teacher profile results in a 'Found new hardware' and of course that isn't happening unless you have admin access. USB stick and portable hard drives all install automatically with any user profile. Sibelius works but obviously without MIDI keyboard to input notes.

    Please, what is the deal with this?

    All those on here I've read talking about their lovely music tech suites and so on... how do you do it? Do you have a single, generic 'music' profile that is set up somehow to allow drivers and other software to work properly, and that every computer is logged in with before class? I've tried contacting Ableton, Focusrite, Edirol and the shop who sold it, as well as endless online searching. Looks to be no info anywhere on this, why does it seem to be such a mystery?

    School IT networks and music don't seem to be able to get along for some reason... well in our case the staff do alright! Just not the equipment.

    Thanks in advance
     
  2. Hi all - I am quite desperate so would really appreciate some input!

    We purchased 15 focusrite saffire 6 audio interfaces, MIDI keyboards and Sibelius 6 to use in a windows 7 based computer classroom with my new GCSE music course. The keyboards came bundled with Ableton live lite 8, as do the saffire 6. Next year we'll have the money to purchase protools 9 which will work with these audio interfaces, but the bundled Ableton should do us fine for now, or so I thought...

    None of this except Sibelius is in any way functional as the audio interface drivers, MIDI keyboard drivers and Ableton are not recognised when logged in as student or teacher, they only work with network manager's admin login. Plugging one of these devices in with a student or teacher profile results in a 'Found new hardware' and of course that isn't happening unless you have admin access. USB stick and portable hard drives all install automatically with any user profile. Sibelius works but obviously without MIDI keyboard to input notes.

    Please, what is the deal with this?

    All those on here I've read talking about their lovely music tech suites and so on... how do you do it? Do you have a single, generic 'music' profile that is set up somehow to allow drivers and other software to work properly, and that every computer is logged in with before class? I've tried contacting Ableton, Focusrite, Edirol and the shop who sold it, as well as endless online searching. Looks to be no info anywhere on this, why does it seem to be such a mystery?

    School IT networks and music don't seem to be able to get along for some reason... well in our case the staff do alright! Just not the equipment.

    Thanks in advance
     
  3. YesMrBronson

    YesMrBronson New commenter

    I don't have any answers, sorry.
    But someone needs to help this guy - it's keeping him awake at night!

    Come on music tech bods - sort it for him.

    Good luck OP.
     
  4. mrkeys

    mrkeys Occasional commenter

    I have always found networks problematic.
    However as your admin guy can work with his profile it seems that you need to look at the differences in the permissions that are set up.
    Sound like the students and staff need to have different profiles created for use in that room. If your admin guy experimenyts with his profile reducing the different permissions then you will find out which areas of the permissions are essential. The only touble is that this will take some time to run through and often that is difficult to achieve. Equally your admin guy will not want your staff and students to have access to the whole network administration so again could be a problem.
    If your machines can be set to stand alone and just use the network for file sharing you may have success. Trouble is tech people want control and stand alone will not give them that.
    Sorry not to be more helpful.
     
  5. Its the case that the software needs local administrator rights... I've hit this problem before and had to create a single profile (with automatic logon) that allows the computer (not the user) access to the local machine.. (to read/write configuration files)



    Windows 7 is NOT the best for audio though.. a lot of problems there!


    Ask your IT people to create a automatic login, single profile for "music" that has LOCAL admin rights so your DAW/Interface can communicate with the local machine/C: drive.
     
  6. I have had this problem with Sibelius 6 and Midi Keyboards.
    Try loading up Sibelius without plugging in the Midi Keyboard. Once loaded, plug in the Midi.
    Hope this works, it did for me
     
  7. YesMrBronson

    YesMrBronson New commenter

    Disagree. I find Windows 7 much better than XP (and certainly better than Vista) for my set up.
     
  8. Bronson - Are you MAD? Xp has never been surpassed. However I will forgive this little Faux Pas.
    The problem with your system, however, IS permissions. Plugging things in in a different order makes little difference - I am very surprised that someone suggests plugging a USB device in after Sibelius has been launched as i find the opposite - if you launch either Sibelius or Cubase without the USB device plugged in first the software fails to find it adn no amount of "find new devices" fixes it. But there you go.
    I have struggled with this for years. One solution is to take your computers off the network and have them stand alone. This creates the problem of sharing files and where individual students save their work - the same student has to use the same computer.
    I think that Guru was suggesting you create one login (although I may have misunderstood his post) - I dont think your tech department will allow this, although it's worth a try. The problem here is accountability - you have a logon so that a user of a computer can be identified, their actions monitored and the access restricted if neccessary. I've tried to get my tech dept to give me a generic account several times and have got nowhere.
    The best answer is to get your technicians to give students specific permissions to run the drivers for your interfaces and keyboards. This took my guy about 4 minutes as he did it remotely in his office. Our computers (running windows 7 - I was forced to change) work fine with our midi keyboards and mostly fine with our audio interfaces - although sometimes they don't select the correct driver and students need to go into the device manager and select it.
    I use a drive called ASIO4ALL which is almost latency free and vastly superior to the generic Windows audio driver. Higly reccomended. Once installed on our computers it worked fine.
     
  9. This is why supplying companies push their installation option. We had a suite of stuff put in by Counterpoint some years ago and this gauranteed that everything was compatible and functional. Pricey to go for this option but well worth the time gained and peace of mind. However, if you have a tech wizard in your school then you might get by if he or she is familiar with networking music software. Good luck!
     
  10. Nope, I record full bands in my studio and have never had problems with Windows 7. My 8 channel focusrite interface has been fine, so has the 8 channel ADAT rack units and plugins. Also the audio interface ASIO driver is always better than the ASIO4ALL driver.
     
  11. v12

    v12

    To overcome this very problem with my new AS Music Tech students, I've bought individual copies of Cubase Artist for the students' laptops.
    They just have to remember to bring them in for their lessons!
     
  12. Dear jerunder

    Get the people who sold you the gear to come and install it and sort it out for you!! Or if they can't just pay for someone like Digital Village to come in and sort it out. In future, never buy stuff that you don't get support for nor on site assistance at short notice. Absolute rule. You may have to pay your way out of this. (Oh, and in the future, get Macs. But that's not helpful for now, I know.)

    Don't accept help/advice from amateurs or non-music technos either, or try to sort it yourself. You'll just waste time.

    WH
     
  13. YesMrBronson

    YesMrBronson New commenter

    Nope.
    Or indeed later.
    Good advice.
     
  14. Mr Bronson, if you have never worked with Macs for music production purposes, you have never lived! jerunder, believe me, Macs are the way to go for music software and digital music productions (in my humble but considerably experienced opinion). Believe what you like of what Mr Bronson has to say, but basically he always has a go at my posts! (For some reason...)
     
  15. YesMrBronson

    YesMrBronson New commenter

    Don't feel singled out walnuthead.

    PCs rule.
     
  16. No, he's right! I've got a room full of PC's and one Mac. The students fight over the mac. The Mac works every time. The mac does not need to be plugged into speakers. The Mac comes with different levels of music production software. The Mac is much easier to use.
    Bad points - students don't normally have macs at home and so can not transfer work.
    Love Logic!
     
  17. I don't think so. It's fine if you are recording live audio and not monitoring through the PC. We use VST instruments and also hardware instruments for Sibelius and latency is an issue. I hate playing a sound and hearing it so much later. This is what happens tith the Windows 7 ASIO. Yes, you can reduce the buffer size but then the instruments start to distort and cut out. ASIO4ALLsolved all of thie immediately.
    It also cut the latency on live audio recording to virtually zero. I monitor through the software so I can add reverb to the monitor mix - the vocalists perform much better if they can her a little reverb.
    Hate latency, love ASIO4ALL.
    However, all of this is a moot point as the original poster can't get his student accounts to access the drivers - which isnormally to do with account permissions.
     
  18. And also in the opinion of the Music Industry in the UK where Logic is the boss.
     
  19. Yes, we had a quote from them for our studio. First of all they did not listen to what we actually wnated but instead tried to tell us what we wanted, which included a whole load of stuff we did not need. The quotation was over £20,000. I went to a local music shop that have a good music technology department and got the lot for £11,000 including their guy coming in and wiring up the patch bays between the studio and the classroom and all the instalation on the PC.
    I have seen a Counter Point studio installation and also a classroom one - they are really Wizzo - but the school across the road that has a studio put in by them has racks of stuff they don't even know how to use - hell, I don't know how to use half of it! Loads of outboard pre-amps and compressors. It's all sitting doing nothing.
    Once again, our poster has their studio, just does not work.
    I'm wondering what the school's own tech support are doing about it?
     
  20. I've got 2 x 30 desk suites and 3 recording studio's with ONLY iMac's and not a PC in sight. We have a couple kicking around in the tech store but that's more for the novelty factor. Apple may be a money sucking company at times but the machines are far superior and last longer, especially when they're being used all day everyday.
     

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