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More pandemic deaths than blitz deaths

Discussion in 'News' started by Corvuscorax, Jun 3, 2020.

  1. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    The UK now has more excess deaths from the pandemic that there were during the Blitz, and its only going up.

    This is nowhere near over
     
    harsh-but-fair likes this.
  2. PeterQuint

    PeterQuint Lead commenter

    That’s an interesting statistic.

    Not sure what you mean by ‘and it’s only going up’.

    The number of deaths per day (on a rolling 7 day average) is going down.

    As for the total number of deaths, we’ll that can only go up.
     
    install likes this.
  3. florian gassmann

    florian gassmann Star commenter

    Although 95% of deaths from the pandemic have been in the age 60+ group, mainly elderly people with other serious health problems, while deaths during the Blitz included large numbers of children and fairly young women.

    (Not that I am suggesting my age group is more expendable :confused:, you understand).
     
    drvs and caterpillartobutterfly like this.
  4. Jonntyboy

    Jonntyboy Lead commenter

    I think we need to look again at all this. There is more going on than meets the eye. Time will tell.

    If you have an open mind and 13 minutes, and are prepared to look at other views, from several normal and balanced non-political doctors, watch this:

     
  5. harsh-but-fair

    harsh-but-fair Star commenter

    Tony Robbins is a catalyst for change and a strategist for success. He creates change in minutes, when normally it couldn't be accomplished in years.

    Okaaaaaay
     
    Marisha likes this.
  6. Jonntyboy

    Jonntyboy Lead commenter

    I know nothing about him. I got the link among half a dozen others in a feed suggested by youtube.

    I used the link, as I mentioned, simply to provide the opportunity to hear some varied views from doctors and health professionals, because I thought they made some interesting points.
     
  7. dumpty

    dumpty Star commenter

  8. harsh-but-fair

    harsh-but-fair Star commenter

    Whatever points they make it doesn't change the fact that in a few months we now have more deaths in this country than 5 years of war and we're not over it yet.
     
    Morninglover and PeterQuint like this.
  9. Jonntyboy

    Jonntyboy Lead commenter

    It's a good link, thanks. There are several good sites that seem bemused in many ways by the science and the data.
    My gut feeling is that somewhere we are missing something; there is something wrong with the figures. But I can't put my finger on it, except to say that I think we may have vastly undercounted the people who have actually had this bug and shown no, or minor, symptoms, which would mean that the death rate is in fact far lower as a %age of cases.
    I also think that we are counting in this country deaths with the virus as deaths from the virus, which is inflating the figures. And I haven't really got time to research.
    One hopes it will all come out in the end...
     
    josiee99 and dumpty like this.
  10. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    I am not counting either, I am counting excess deaths, which is tens of thousands higher than either deaths from the virus, and deaths with the virus, and is the number of deaths we have had above and beyond the expected number of deaths in this country for this length of time.

    It includes, for example, the large number of deaths from heart attacks, which may or may not be caused by corona virus. The virus is known to cause heart attacks in people who have the virus, even if they have no other symptoms, and don't get tested. It is also suspected that some people have died due to fear of going into hospital. Whether that fear is justified or not is difficult to assess, certainly many people have died from CV caught in hospital. Either way, these are excess deaths because of the pandemic

    There is the argument that many people who died with CV were dying anyway, But this statistic, from the ONS, of excess deaths, is not counting anyone who would have died anyway. It is not possible to say in an individual case whether someone would have died or not, but it is possible to say that overall, there have been more than 60 thousand excess deaths in the country.

    Interesting ( if that is the word) that so many causes of deaths have gone down, like road traffic accidents, drowning, alcohol related deaths, yet the excess deaths is still so high
     
  11. install

    install Star commenter

    Agree .

    But to compare pandemic deaths to blitz deaths is a bit daft imho. Far better to compare it with another pandemic.
     
  12. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    why? I chose to compare it to the blitz precisely becasue there isn't a pandemic to compare it to. The Blitz is the closest disaster in scale in the UK in living memory, and people have a sense of the human cost of the Blitz.
     
    colacao17 likes this.
  13. Morninglover

    Morninglover Star commenter

    369 deaths in the UK in last 24 hours in UK; yesterday Spain had 2nd day in a row with no deaths. Maybe we need to ask them how to defeat this virus?
     
    ACOYEAR8 and harsh-but-fair like this.
  14. ACOYEAR8

    ACOYEAR8 Star commenter

    English has no real word for lockdown. That's why .....
     
  15. florian gassmann

    florian gassmann Star commenter

    Surely the obvious comparator is the Spanish Flu pandemic? It killed 228,000 UK citizens, mostly between October 1918 and June 1919.
     
  16. botanybod

    botanybod New commenter

    What is an interesting statistic, is that yesterday, the UK had more reported deaths than all 27 EU states put together. Why is that do you think? Something to do with our inability to control it, or something to do with the figures that are reported? Either way that is a shocking statistic, and one which should worry us all. The fact that our Prime Minister seems to think we've somehow been successful, is disgusting. I guess it depends on how you measure success.
     
    Alice K and Catgirl1964 like this.
  17. SEBREGIS

    SEBREGIS Lead commenter

    If the number of people who had died from the coronavirus started going down I'd be even more alarmed. It would mean they were returning from the grave.
     
  18. historyexcel

    historyexcel New commenter

    I don't want to detract from the key point which is too many people are dead, and will die from, the coronavirus in the UK. However for accuracy over 43,000 people died in the blitz, as of today I believe 39,728 people have died from coronavirus in the UK. I agree in both cases this figure is way too high.
     
  19. Corvuscorax

    Corvuscorax Star commenter

    Blitz death estimates are 60 000, including unidentified victims. Excess deaths from the pandemic are over 60 000
     
  20. PeterQuint

    PeterQuint Lead commenter

    I certainly agree that our death toll is extremely worrying.

    But despite my dislike for Johnson, in the interests of fairness, we won’t really know how we’ve done both here and in the rest of Europe until this is all over and we can count excess deaths.
     
    Jonntyboy likes this.

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