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May backs grammar school expansion

Discussion in 'Education news' started by emerald52, Aug 7, 2016.

  1. needabreak

    needabreak Star commenter

    I was told that when we were starting O'levels in our (newly changed from Grammar) comprehensive only 20% of students would do O'levels and of them only 20% would go on to A'Levels, as I knew my peers often left after A'levels I guess this left a very small number of clever people who went to university... *pats self and other Tessers on the back... assuming these figures were correct (I only have my old HT's say so on this) is this really the type of education we need now?
    emerald52 likes this.
  2. needabreak

    needabreak Star commenter

    When gaming costs, it puts many out of the game!
  3. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter

    There was a very good edition of More or Less on Radio 4 which had a five minute overview of Grammar schools... if memory serves it was a mixed bag.
    emerald52 likes this.
  4. JosieWhitehead

    JosieWhitehead Star commenter

    In life we communicate with people of all different levels of education and we often learn a lot from those who are better at one thing or another than we are ourselves. You discover when you retire that those who are good at different subjects run U3A groups to which we all go, whatever our intelligence. Why segregate people at the age of 11? Sit a child who is good at a particular subject with some who are not, and they will perhaps be able to help the less able. It could be that you are developing in the bright ones, good qualities of teaching? Failing the 11 plus is not an indication that you don't want to work or learn, or that you come from a home where you are not encouraged to be polite or do your best. Passing the 11 plus doesn't mean that you are the sort of person who will work hard and succeed or that you have any better manners than someone at a secondary modern. In my youth, you usually failed the 11 plus because of your parents' occupations and were graded according to your class. We were all very conscious of this - but our parents were ambitious for us and wanted us to do better in life than they did, of course.
    needabreak likes this.
  5. palmtree100

    palmtree100 Lead commenter

    This simply isn't the case.

    Yes there are non-verbal reasoning papers, but there are also maths, verbal reasoning and English comprehension papers in the outer London areas whose 11+ tests I'm familiar with.
    the maths is based on the national curriculum stuff (but harder) , verbal reasoning relies on having a high level and wide-ranging vocabulary as does the comprehension paper.

    The level of language children are exposed to at home is very much linked to class and can disadvantage bright EAL children.

    These are not IQ tests and the skills to pass them need to be taught. Hence the wealth of study guides and practice books available in the shops at pretty steep prices.
  6. palmtree100

    palmtree100 Lead commenter

    What? I have a good O-level maths but have you seen any recent GCSE higher papers? I had to give up trying to help my son with his homework by about year 10 - couldn't understand a word of it!
  7. palmtree100

    palmtree100 Lead commenter

    Which came first? The decline of the area or the arrival of Eastern Europeans?

    Oh ok. Thank you. Not the fault of the immigrants then.
  8. palmtree100

    palmtree100 Lead commenter

    Are you Katie Hopkins?
    emerald52 likes this.
  9. zannar

    zannar New commenter

    I was told at the age of 11 that I would not survive in an academic environment. I went to a secondary modern and felt bored and frustrated. I was taught how to wash clothes, sew and cook. Only the top 10% of the class were allowed to do chemistry. The rest of did biology ( after all we were only being groomed for marriage and motherhood). The feelings of inadequacy stayed with me a long time. I always wanted to be a teacher but felt I was not good enough. I went to college and understood my business studies. I progressed to banking, the armed forces, the civil service and eventually TA jobs. During this time I realised that I was intelligent, I could research and learn and gained enough confidence to attempt teacher training at the age of 42.
    I was proud of my efforts but I was, and still am, very angry that I was written off by the education system at such a young age. I don't want to see other children suffer as I did.
    Give state schools the smaller classes, funding and support and they will support and encourage all children and all children will accept their peers as being their equals in many ways while accepting each individual has qualities needed in our world. We cannot all be academics, and not all of us want to be, but we need to give everyone the opportunity.
    Our society today is too selective in many ways. No more-please.
  10. hhhh

    hhhh Lead commenter

    I wish we could find a better way than selection by mortgage.
    vannie likes this.
  11. palmtree100

    palmtree100 Lead commenter

    Great post.
  12. TCSC47

    TCSC47 Star commenter

    As I follow the discussions here and in the media, I am coming more and more to the conclusion that it is all a red herring to set up a smoke screen to hide the messes that May is facing. However, it is vitally important that we make all the arguments against more grammar schools, in effect falling for it.

    If a decent fuss is not made then pro grammar people would claim that the country was quite happy for them to be introduced.

    What with setting up Boris, Davis and Fox to take the fall when Brexic fails, May is looking like one cunning woman.
  13. florian gassmann

    florian gassmann Star commenter

    "Brexit fails" ?

    You mean the EU might refuse to let us go?
  14. Maths_Shed

    Maths_Shed Occasional commenter

    Isn't it worse than that? I would imagine that the changes will result in many independent schools converting becoming selective academies whilst maintaining their existing clientele who no longer have to pay for the pleasure. With no fees to pay parents will have a hefty wad in their pockets and these new schools will tap into that whilst also tapping into public funds. The middle classes will think it's fantastic and will continue to vote in the party that wrecks education foe the masses.
  15. schoolsout4summer

    schoolsout4summer Star commenter

    It could be dangerous to even discuss this, let alone have an opinion that does not conform to the politically correct view of these matters - especially if you are a teacher.
  16. TCSC47

    TCSC47 Star commenter

    No, when people are faced with the mess created by Brexic and see what we have lost.

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