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Madeley: Viral hide-and-seek

Discussion in 'Personal' started by DrLinus, Sep 29, 2020.

  1. DrLinus

    DrLinus Lead commenter

    Some good points.
    How many people have died because the NHS has been overwhelmed by measures taken to ensure it is not overwhelmed?

     
    Jonntyboy, Kandahar and Dunteachin like this.
  2. Dunteachin

    Dunteachin Star commenter

    I have reached exactly the same conclusions.

    Vulnerable people should shield themselves, and the rest of society should just get back to normal.

    I cannot see any other way out of this, until a tried and tested vaccine comes along.
     
  3. 7eleven

    7eleven Senior commenter

    He does make some good points, but I have a problem with people who state their OPINION with the conviction it is FACT. We have no way of knowing what would have happened if we didn’t have the lockdown. Was it 12,000 deaths he spoke of, caused by no access to hospitals? Perhaps the deaths from Covid might have been ten times that if we hadn’t locked down. I just don’t think it’s this simple.
     
  4. nizebaby

    nizebaby Star commenter

    Does that mean the 12000 deaths from other caused were an acceptable sacrifice in view of the prospect of far more deaths from covid?
     
    Dunteachin likes this.
  5. 7eleven

    7eleven Senior commenter

    I don’t know.
     
  6. Dunteachin

    Dunteachin Star commenter

    I had a hospital appointment, this morning. The doctor expressed surprise that I'd had a letter to attend, because "we've been told not to do routine follow-ups".

    That's because there's, obviously, a backlog of people who urgently need seeing, who have been waiting for months.

    The collateral damage is huge.
     
    bombaysapphire and smoothnewt like this.
  7. LondonCanary

    LondonCanary Star commenter

    More people should admit this in respect of all things Covid.
     
  8. nizebaby

    nizebaby Star commenter

    Of course, you do have to think about balancing the number of deaths from different causes. I don't envy the people resonsible for doing that.
     
  9. 7eleven

    7eleven Senior commenter

    More people should admit this about many subjects, I think. I wish more people really understood the difference between fact and opinion. That’s just my opinion, of course :)
     
  10. Dunteachin

    Dunteachin Star commenter

    I don't think Madeley was presenting facts. He was expressing his opinions.
    Which may sound factual.:rolleyes:
     
    anotherauntsally and nomad like this.
  11. magic surf bus

    magic surf bus Star commenter

    My thinking too. Not necessarily fair, but how it will ultimately turn out, whether we older and more vulnerable people like it or not, and with or without all the government's blather and bluster. Mass restrictions are largely unenforceable so infection rates will rise. The vast majority who catch it will recover and who wants to survive to live in a wrecked economy where our kids have no worthwhile future? At present around one in a thousand are dying from it. We each have to make our own assessment of risk versus priorities and proceed with caution.

    As for the overwhelmed NHS, a year now spent waiting for a clear diagnosis of my throat condition, with the next test postponed indefinitely. It could be worse - I could have been told that it's horrible and have had my treatment delayed. I accept my place in their current order of priorities, but it would be nice to be told what it is (rather than what it isn't) at some point.
     
  12. DrLinus

    DrLinus Lead commenter

    He was open about this but his opinions might be correct.
    He is certainly affected by the death of his friend.
     
  13. Dunteachin

    Dunteachin Star commenter

    Unfortunately, many of us will have similar stories to tell.
     
  14. DrLinus

    DrLinus Lead commenter

    We cannot blame any such for coming to Madeley's conclusion.
    It is at times like this that the benefits of private healthcare are recognised.
    It would be good were there some way of compelling smokers to take out private medical insurance.
     
  15. Scintillant

    Scintillant Star commenter

    The NHS will be overwhelmed if we do not take measures to prevent transmission.

    And then even more people will die due to the discussed knock-on effects.
     
    modelmaker, anotherauntsally and hhhh like this.
  16. Scintillant

    Scintillant Star commenter

    If we did not lockdown and reduce transmission, that would obviously end up being far higher. And there would be far more Covid deaths too.
     
  17. CraigCarterSmith

    CraigCarterSmith Lead commenter

    This is the greatest thing i've ever read on this Forum

    More people shouldn't be afraid to just say, "it's difficult and I just don't know" about a variety of so many things, this is an impossible situation and one that really offers no comparisons with any other countries due to population density, climate and life habits
     
  18. DrLinus

    DrLinus Lead commenter

    Do you think your diagnosis would have cost someone's life?
     
  19. hhhh

    hhhh Star commenter

    https://twitter.com/jimbiancolo/status/1310589001150222336
    "I say this to at least five people a week: ‘No, you can’t isolate older people.’ Or people with a disability. Or people immunocompromised. It is a fantasy of people who prefer not to sacrifice.”

    You don't necessarily know if you're vulnerable! Some of the people I've known who had it almost died, or are still very weak months later, despite (some of them) being quite young and very fit.
    Trump and co might preach herd immunity or mentality, but many of us are not far-right, and are quite happy to keep people safe, as qualified doctors tell us, just be sensible until the vaccine arrives!
    https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co....ronavirus-rules-explained-public-health-boss/

    And I've been awaiting treatment for a health concern since before March. And I have family in hospital, so it's not as if I wouldn't prefer things to be 'normal'.
     
    emerald52, LiamD and Dunteachin like this.
  20. hhhh

    hhhh Star commenter

    Yes, don't these people realise that those in hospital for other things (myself included, before my last op!) are MORE at risk from Covid? OR should we just pretend Covid doesn't exist, and happily open schools and hospitals fully?
     

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