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jehovah's witnesses

Discussion in 'Religious Education' started by clarenut, Nov 2, 2007.

  1. Post 37 is worth more thought and I may or may not reply to that.

    Post 38 is just yet another rude attack and out of keeping with this forum.

    As is symptomatic of such attacks the writer has simply not understood the point being made.

    This is nothing about barring or preventing. It is about making extra effort.

    Easy to insult; more mature to debate.
     
  2. wow! didn't mean to start such a debate just asking for experiences and ideas really. In an early years setting there is rarely such a thing as an explicit RE lesson - withdrawal from that would be easy, it's the general topic approach which gets a bit tricky when you try to teach in a holistic meaningful way and 2 of your kids are not supposed to have involvement of Christmas activities at the request of parents. lots of things will be adapted but it is a bit difficult to not do Christmas in a class of 3 - 5 year olds!!!!! and any ideas on where to put them when I'm being Christmassy! (In the cupboard?!!)
     
  3. Shouldileave, you say "It is easy to insult" it is to insult you, but that was not my intention or my post.

    I heap scorn upon your argument because it isn't one.

    It is " more mature to debate" but as you seem to be so egocentric you are unable to understand or better appreciate an alternate point of view this cannot be done.

    If as you say it is a matter of extra effort you need to make your self more clear. There is no more additional effort need to teach JW, than to teach any other faith group.

    Many previous threads have dealt with your legal and contractural responsibilities vis a vis JW, and it is clear that by and large it is either they take part or they leave the classroom, there is no need for a second lesson plan.
     
  4. shouldileave.......YES
     
  5. pete14

    pete14 New commenter

    What a great idea. Get 3-5 year olds to roleplay a conversation including the star of Satan, wise men from Satan, various prophecies, and pagan origins of Christmas. I am sure they will be able to cope with that and probably even write a precis for homework!!!

    I echo post 44
     
  6. So do I
     
  7. i take shouldileave's point. However, the real issue here is tolerance. Christmas is a festival celebrated by Christians, Eid is one celebrated by Muslims and so on. If JWs are in attendance at a school that teaches multiple faiths then they too have to be tolerant when that school teaches about things that are forbidden in their religion.

    My advice is send a note home to parents stating that you are about to teach about Christmas and should they have any problems then they have the right to withdraw their child and set their own work.

    It's not our job to try and ensure that certain groups never come into contact with content that they may disagree with. It is our job to even-handedly provide information about religions and ask children to consider what they might learn themselves form each religion. This isn't the same as conversion or indoctination so there should be no need for any parent to worry.

    I think shouldileave's point is this in fact. That by making the choice to send their children to the 'forbidden school' those parents also have to accept that the same school may teach about things that do not make up their belief system. not our problem!
     
  8. Thank you for posts 44, 45 and 46. Really constructive comments and ones that are of great help to mature discussion.

    Let me remind you of the OP which in your desire to insult and tendency to misread, you have missed:

    "I have 2 Jehovah's witnesses in my class ( only 8 in total)any ideas how I get around this -i am certainly not abandoning Christmas and I will adapt every activity to a winter one if possible but how am i going to cope with story time, concert prac etc etc they can't be taken out for everything "

    So here is someone who will take extra measures 'adapt every activity' and is worried because even more extra measures (taking out) cannot be done.

    So my single point remains. Given that they're not closely following their religion (witness Watchtower quotes) why make the extra effort?

     
  9. Yeah, why not mate - I mean, **** 'em, they're hypocrites aren't they?








    (irony alert)
     
  10. I am having some horrific Groundhog Day experience.

    Is this really going anwhere? The same point is being made over and over again, regaredless of how anybody responds.
     
  11. pete14

    pete14 New commenter

    Post 48 - who are you to say they are not strictly following their religion? I agree that they are not strictly folowing the narrow fundamentalist interpretation of the religion as shown in a collection of old watchtower quotes taken out of context in an American website. According to these criteria, I suspect that the huge majority of JWs are not strictly following their religion. I guess this may surprise them!!

    Incidentally I have no desire to insult but the suggestion of such young children roleplaying the conversations you gave a link to is completely ridiculous. Maybe you misread the OP and didn't realise they were so very young.

    I guess OP is wanting to make the extra effort because she is a dedicated teacher who wants her whole class to be involved whilst being sufficiently sensitive to their individual needs. All 'shouldileave' seems to want to do is give her an excuse not to do what she thinks (quite correctly) is the right think for her class. I only hope some of the postings questioning her wish to do this have not put her off.
     
  12. And again the misunderstandings continue.

    I really do not see how I can make my postings on this thread any clearer.

    It's obviously just me.

    Post 49: I am talking about 'extra effort'. You could legitimately argue against making 'extra' effort for anyone. So your 'irony alert' is pointless.

    Post 50: the responses have in the main been of an insulting nature and/or simply betray the inability of the poster to understand the one single simple point I am making. Hence the repetition.

    Post 51: missing the point again. I am not being judgemental. I am not saying someone is or is not following the religion BUT according to their religion they should not even be there - so why the 'extra' effort?

    I am not giving any 'excuse' - I am simply asking 'why?' given that they're not strict adherents anyway.

    I see again you have avoided the 'bacon' question.

    Perhaps you didn't understand it.

    I am a pupil in your class. I open the lunchbox I was given by my parents. Inside are bacon sandwiches which I then eat. I also tell you we regularly eat pork for dinner.

    I then ask for special arrangements for me in lessons as Jesus was a prophet not a deity. These extras would require you to put in your freetime.

    Do you acquiesce?



     
  13. Surely this is a joke??
     
  14. Some do find insulting someone a joke, yes. Still if it helps you to avoid a question.
     
  15. I've noticed you have started lying about me now:

    72 | Posted by: pete14 at 05 Nov 2007 16:54
    Post 64 was posted by 'shouldileave' on the RE forum in response to a reasonable question from a young teacher about how to cope with a couple of JW children in the weeks leading up to Christmas. It is sad that threads posted genuinely on sensitive issues can be hijacked to put across another agenda. A young woman has died. That is an opportunity for informed discussion not a completely biassed rant.


    I am not 'average'.

     
  16. pete14

    pete14 New commenter

    If you read carefully, at no point did I call you average 'shouldileave'. The posting I made on opinion which you have reproduced here, attributed the posting in this thread to you and not to 'average' who repeated it on the thread on opinion. I do not like being accused of lying, especially when it is demonstrably an incorrect accusation.

    As for your statement that you are not being judgemental - surely stating quite clearly that by allowing their children to be in school with non JWs they are not following their religion correctly is making a judgement. In my opinion this judgement is based on false criteria.

    As other posters have said, we appear to be going round in circles and getting nowhere.
     
  17. And again you misunderstand.

    We go round in circles because you don't read posts.

    You suggest i am being judgemental. I will simply repeat the post made before - and my answer to it.

    Same old, same old...

    21 | Posted by: 2stripes at 03 Nov 2007 20:12
    'you cannot pick and choose and then expect non-believers to make special allowances for the bits you pick to follow'
    'as according to their own religion they shouldn't even be there, there is no need to make special allowances'

    and i'm the one being judgemental and condemnatory?
    mmm.


    22 | Posted by: Shouldileave at 03 Nov 2007 20:59
    Well, yes, I suppose Jehovah is being judgemental but then He's allowed to be surely?

    Remember my post (which 'shocked') was almost entirely quotations from the JW own magazine.

    And still my bacon question is unanswered.

     
  18. This information is very exaggerated and unfair!

    The best thing to do is discuss anything with the child and the parents. Witness children are very aware of their faith and what they do. There is a brochure you can be given by the child/parents which is informative.

    In terms of work, stick to a theme... If you're doing Xmas, give the child a winter themed project to do. If its Easter, get the child to make a booklet about what they do at that time of year. Witness kids are easy going and nothing about them is a nuisance. They do have a life too, contrary to the above, a very full, active and social one.

    All the best
     
  19. And yet oddly they are less judgmental towards others than some on this thread?
    Just an observation.
     

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