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is there a legal class size limit any more??

Discussion in 'Early Years' started by clare3, Apr 28, 2011.

  1. Does anyone know if the infant class size rule still applies? I could be having 35 in my reception class next year! Do any of you do (and manage) this at the moment?
     
  2. NellyFUF

    NellyFUF Lead commenter

    Er em single handed?
    Oh er mrs.
     
  3. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    Yes infant class size (which applies to reception classes & KS1) is 30 to a single qualified teacher more than 30 and there should be a second teacher unless the child/ren were admitted as "exceptions"
     
  4. Thanks Msz, I thought as much! Will wait and see what the next couple of weeks brings!
     
  5. Is there a limit for Nursery classes? In legislation, not EYFS.
     
  6. In my understanding EYFS statutory guidance is legislation. So the ratios detailed in there have to be followed as regards class sizes and numbers of qualified adults etc. However, the school where I work has recently been advised to recruit another teacher for the nursery class (39 children) to bring the ratio of teachers/ children up to the level you would need for reception class. So there are now 2 teachers and 1 level 3 TA whereas before it was 1 teacher and 2 TAs. I think this exceeds the statutory requirements.
    The other factor is amount of space available. That is detailed in the statutory requirements as well.
     
  7. katycustard

    katycustard Occasional commenter

    Sorry, I misunderstood and I don't know of any other legislation other then EYFS. [​IMG]
     
  8. anon2799

    anon2799 New commenter

    Me either, but under EYFS they do. Sorry I can't be any more help.
     
  9. GemsEYFS

    GemsEYFS New commenter

    In my nursery class, i have 45 children.
    There is only myself as a teacher and 3 TA's- Is this ok ?I would say an additional teacher is needed as everything fals onto me and takes me a life time t complete certain activities that I as the teacher need to do!
     
  10. katycustard

    katycustard Occasional commenter

    If you are in England I would say this is not okay. In my nursery the teacher's and other key workers do exactly the same tasks, although that doesn't mean you shouldn't have another teacher!
     
  11. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    The EYFS recommends that, where the size of a group or class exceeds 26
    children, it would be good practice to assign an
    additional teacher to it and that an additional
    teacher should always be assigned when the size of a class exceeds 30.
     
  12. chubbyone

    chubbyone New commenter

    Can I just clarify some points please and see if my understanding is correct.
    1. Legally the ratio in nursery is 1-13 and if you have 26 children one must be a teacher and the additional adult does not need to be a teacher but had to be a level 3?
    2.legally the ratio in a reception class is 1-30, so if you had 30 children in your reception class there only needs to legally be a teacher? Any additional adult is not legally required?
    Are these 2 statements correct for a primary school in England?
    The reason I am asking is I am currently in year 1 and want to take the year group to the seaside. Legally I know the ration for the trip is 1-6 so need 10 adults. When I requested the additional staff from reception ad they are using my additional staff, I was told could not have them ad need them in reception. My point was that just for one day we would not be breaking any 'legal' requirement in reception as the ratio is 1-30.
    Thanks
     
  13. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    correct

     
  14. chubbyone

    chubbyone New commenter

    Thanks msz! Did not think I was being stupid when told can not have reception lsp for the trip because need them in reception, of which I said why as ratio is 1-30. Many thanks. Incidentally the person who said this to me' us on the SLT team so you would gave thought they would know the ratios! If I did not need the member of staff I would nit have asked but need them as need 2 first aiders as 2 classes and the reception lsp is a first aider.
     
  15. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    They probably are needed in reception as it's difficult to follow EYFS principles with a single teacher but there is no legal requirement for them to be there it is one of the failings in EYFS.
     
  16. chubbyone

    chubbyone New commenter

    We only need 1 adult as we need a first aider, it will still leave 3 adults in a 60 place reception of which one is a paediatric first aider and in addition to this 3 additional staff for children who have hours, so it will still leave 6 adults with 60 children instead of 7. I myself 2 years ago worked in reception and totally understand the situation and I always go last to reception for staff but unfortunately this year the 2 first aiders in the school except foundation staff who are either 1-1 with a child with profound needs and the other needs to stay as it would leave no first aider in schoool in teaching hours as all others are dinner supervisors. I need a first aider on the trip as can not take 60 children without one. Incidently as a school we have voiced the lack of first aiders. But like I say it still would leave 60 reception with 6 adults.
     
  17. anon2799

    anon2799 New commenter

    It won't help you now but I'd suggest to your boss that you have an inset day next tear where everyone is first aid trained. We do this at my school every 3 years. It means that it doesn't always fall to the sane people because everyone is trained. It cost me about £600 to train 40 staff.
     
  18. Hi y'all - just trying to get some clarification on this one - I have 32 reception children - me as teacher and at various points during the week no TA! Is this legal? I had a situation yesterday with a wet child who needed changing and 31 others trying to get changed after P.E. Only 4 of the children could manage this independently, absolute nightmare - any ideas? I feel I need to get all my facts in place before I approach head/LA etc?!
     
  19. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    It really depends on the circumstances the additional two children were admitted I'm afraid.
    The Infant Class size limit (30-1) applies to reception classes but there are excepted pupils
    In extremely limited circumstances, an infant class may have more than 30 pupils.

    Pupils may be admitted in unforeseen circumstances, e.g.

    • Where a child moves into an area outside the normal admissions round and there is no other school within a reasonable distance (for advice contact PSU).

    • Where a child receives a statement of special educational needs naming the school, outside the normal admissions round.

    • Where an extra place has to be offered because an error has been made in the admissions process that leads to a pupil being refused a place incorrectly.

    • Where an appeal panel decides that an admission authority has made an error which denied the child a place or has acted unreasonably in initially refusing to admit a pupil.

    Pupils admitted for the above reasons are classed as excepted pupils. The class may remain in excess of 30 pupils only for the remainder of the academic year. The following September the school will need to agree arrangements with the LEA to comply with the limit.
     
  20. Poor you! How do you manage the outdoor area? Do you only have it open at certain times? We don't do PE now as our outdoor area is open for most of the day and so this more than satisfies their physical development needs. Would that be an option for you? Getting changed before and after PE is just a nightmare with new Reception!
     

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