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Is Gavin getting rid of UPS?

Discussion in 'Education news' started by paulstevenjones, Sep 21, 2019.

  1. paulstevenjones

    paulstevenjones New commenter

    tonymars likes this.
  2. Sundaytrekker

    Sundaytrekker Star commenter

    Interesting. A flatter pay structure and the writing on the wall for keeping it separated into main scale and upper. Perhaps that might actually help experienced teachers a little if there isn’t so much incentive to get rid of them for being too expensive l
  3. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    But it will also mean that teachers who are good at the job, but don't want to climb the greasy pole will not earn enough to make them feel rewarded for the effort skills and energy they bring to the job.
    Catgirl1964 and DrResource like this.
  4. DrResource

    DrResource New commenter

    Too true! After 20 years of this s##t you become resigned to the fact that being a great teacher just isn't all that important to anyone ☹️
    Catgirl1964 and Grandsire like this.
  5. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    He specifically says though that STRB should give 'advisory' pay points on MPR and UPR so sounds like STPCD is going back to specifying M1 to M6 and UPS1 to UPS3 like it used to, but tis time advisory not mandatory. I see no suggestion that UPR will cease to exist.

    "Flatter pay structure' is, I fear, just politician speak for 'the govt wants a headline grabbing increase at the bottom but there's no money for an increase like that for other teachers, so tough luck.'
    phlogiston and Sundaytrekker like this.
  6. blue451

    blue451 Lead commenter

    Teaching is fast becoming something you do for a few years before you get a real job.

    Won't be long before they take the 'profession' off the people-who-can-sign-a-passport-application list.
    paulstevenjones likes this.
  7. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    Thing is that it takes a while to get good. As you get older you don't want to live like a student any more.
    Lala24, Catgirl1964 and Mrsmumbles like this.
  8. paulstevenjones

    paulstevenjones New commenter

    No i think the writing is on the wall for ups. It is too expensive and I think it is going.
  9. Mrsmumbles

    Mrsmumbles Star commenter

    Gavin is being a bit tooltastic, in my humble opinion.
  10. diddydave

    diddydave Established commenter

    "Of course, in reaching your recommendations on 2020/21 pay award, you will want to ensure they are affordable within the funding settlement announced."

    Why am I not surprised that a sentence like this one did not appear in the review of MP's salaries.
    Catgirl1964 and paulstevenjones like this.
  11. diddydave

    diddydave Established commenter

    "Evidence of the national state of teacher and school leader supply, including rates of recruitment and retention, vacancy rates and the quality of candidates entering the profession;"

    It will be interesting to see if the review body would rather ensure that their recommendations lead to a competitive pay and retention policy, IF that conflicts with the 'suggestion' that they restrict the total bill to some arbitrary figure a minister has set, or if they are not as independent as one might hope.
    paulstevenjones likes this.
  12. applecrumblebumble

    applecrumblebumble Lead commenter

    If a narrowing of the pay scale comes about as a result of this review then you have to accept that this government is only interested in recruitment of cannon fodder. They have and will continue to fail teachers with their short term policies. Teaching will become a fast food education service.
  13. Grandsire

    Grandsire Senior commenter

    It’s as good already gone, in my opinion. Now there’s no pay portability, and academies are free to pay whatever they choose, the only way for an experienced UPS teacher like me to cling on to their UPS pay is to stay at the same school. Most rural schools near me haven’t really been able to afford to appoint anything other then newly qualified teachers for some years now.

    The loss of the UPS will be the final nail in the coffin of teaching as a profession - the only way to make it worthwhile as a career will be to leave the classroom and enter management of the inexperienced but cheap labour at the chalkface.
    Catgirl1964 likes this.
  14. diddydave

    diddydave Established commenter

    "Your views on the role of progression to the upper pay range and the continued case for separate main and upper pay ranges."

    Of course a sentence like this in their remit may lead them to advise scrapping the UPR if they see that the threshold is a major barrier to retention. I will need to look at the national figures on the numbers of teachers in each age group over the years to see if there is evidence of, what we suspect, older (UPS) teachers being squeezed out.
  15. diddydave

    diddydave Established commenter

    Young and cheap versus old and experienced:
  16. moscowbore

    moscowbore Lead commenter

    I would go further than most here. Academies can pay or not pay as they please. I would say that the whole notion of a pay scale is an anachronism.

    I agree totally that budget cuts have prevented schools from recruiting experienced staff. Anecdotal evidence suggests that the experienced/expensive staff have been disposed of under the cover of "support" plans. There is a strategy at work here.

    I see the strategy. Reduce the cost of the workforce. Then call in Pearson to run online courses. Teachers are then reduced to zero hours contracts to deliver courses over a webcam. Tory pals then make even more money from education. Proper education, i.e. involving actual teachers, becomes the privilege of the rich.

    Do the government care if state education is delivered by teachers who only have a few years of teaching experience? Nah!!!!
  17. lindenlea

    lindenlea Star commenter

    Budget cuts are not a fact of life. they are a political choice, so use your vote at every opportunity.
    Catgirl1964 likes this.
  18. paulstevenjones

    paulstevenjones New commenter

    I would be very interested to see these findings.
  19. Catgirl1964

    Catgirl1964 Occasional commenter

    The tone of Williamson's letter seems to suggest that differentials will become compressed and more experienced teachers' pay will not increase significantly in order to pay for big increases in starting salaries. How unfair is that! Another interpretation is that experienced teachers will have to accept smaller rises as a result of the recruitment crisis.
  20. applecrumblebumble

    applecrumblebumble Lead commenter

    If I remember correctly recent OECD figures put the U.K. as having the second lowest proportion of 50+ teachers

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