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If new teachers are soon to get £30K minimum, what about more experienced teachers??

Discussion in 'Education news' started by mindthegap, Sep 6, 2019.

  1. mindthegap

    mindthegap New commenter

    What will happen to pay for other main scale teachers? Will teachers on M4 suddenly get about the same as an NQT? Will there be a much smaller gap between pay between top and bottom of the main scale or will those higher up the scale get more pay too? If not, surely the retention crisis will just shift to the more experienced teachers who will resent the lack of acknowledgement of their contribution to the profession compared to NQTs'.

    I'm hoping someone can shed some light on this!
    Mrsmumbles likes this.
  2. letap

    letap Occasional commenter

    The new top of the scale will probably become circa £30k. The Tax payers alliance views the rise in the main scale as a significant wage rise and was the basis for their argument that teachers should not get a wage rise on top of going up the scale. Matthew Elliot a very significant advisor in Downing Street was one of the founders of the tax payers alliance.
  3. blue451

    blue451 Lead commenter

    "If new teachers are soon to get £30K minimum"

    Don't be silly, they're not. It astounds me that people believe claims like this made as the bumbling incumbent of nº10 gears up for an election.
  4. MrMedia

    MrMedia Star commenter

    It's just political whiffery designed to make you vote for them. They won't actually give everyone 6 grand a year more.
  5. SomethingWicked

    SomethingWicked Occasional commenter

    Further, an ever-diminishing proportion of teachers stay in the job long enough to actually climb MPS, so they won't win any votes by pushing the top end of the pay scale up anyway.
    FormosaRed likes this.
  6. PeterQuint

    PeterQuint Lead commenter

    I suspect (if this happens) other salaries will increase by inflation-Ish.

    Enough to maintain a semblance of differentials.

    By the way, I’m fairly confident these rises will happen. No because I trust Johnson. But I trust his (and other politicians) fear of a backlash.

    When people say that politicians lie, there may be some truth in that, but it’s rarely an out-and-out “We’re doing this..,now we’ve decided we can’t be bothered”.
  7. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    I suspect that the £30k may have something to do with the rules about the minimum salary for immigrants.
  8. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    Nobody knows!

    Apart from the headline-grabbing £30k figure not a single detail has appeared from the DfE. The next steps is that the DfE will request the STRB to come up with the detail. STRB will be given a 'letter of remit' by DfE that sets out the broad parameters. Since it isn't due to take effect until 2022 that doesn't have to happen until the autumn of 2021 so don't hold your breath!

    Another question is what happens to payscale for London teachers? Bottom of main pay range is already over £30k for Inner London teachers.
  9. Sundaytrekker

    Sundaytrekker Star commenter

    That’s a really good point, phlogiston. My guess is the main scale will become very small, maybe just two or three points. Other points will not go up by any more than inflation. One consequence will be there isn’t the budgetary incentive to employ NQTs so they might find it harder to get started. Equally, there will be less incentive to get rid of expensive UPS teachers so maybe they’ll find it easier to stay.

    Just my guesswork.
  10. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    Who knows?
    One view of pay progression is that it was a way of paying less experienced teachers less than the full rate.
    I suspect that the scale may narrow, and that schools may end up with less flexibility for paying extra for responsibility.
    applecrumblebumble likes this.
  11. JohnJCazorla

    JohnJCazorla Star commenter

    Not even this batch of politicians are daft enough to say that, whether they are sensible enough to say a variant on this is another matter,
    "Thanks to the wrecking tactics invoked by the Enemies of the People then we cannot find the money for 2022 but rest assured that it will be forthcoming in 2024"
  12. applecrumblebumble

    applecrumblebumble Lead commenter

    Who knows indeed.
    They could uplift all the pay scales but make it a two year process like UPS and then you go up the pay scale after two PRP appraisals. The effect would make recruitment more attractive and retention because using a CARE pension scheme would mean it would take longer to get UPS etc.
  13. R13

    R13 Occasional commenter

    The 'additional money' coming into schools along with this promise isn't enough to make up all the shortfalls . . . . so the main thing that will happen if NQTs get a substantial rise to take them to £30,000 is that there will have to be less teachers as the overall pot can't afford the rise. I'll leave others to suggest which teachers are less likely to be retained
    install likes this.
  14. rosievoice

    rosievoice Star commenter

  15. install

    install Star commenter

    Imho experienced teachers are poorly treated in terms of performance, pay and promotions. And teaching seems to be ageist in this respect.
  16. DrResource

    DrResource New commenter

    It won;t happen. The 2.5 ish% we are getting this September has to come from EXISTING BUDGETS.
    My school luckily will pay up due to some savings elsewhere. I suspect many won't be able to afford to give the pay rise,
    agathamorse likes this.
  17. strawbs

    strawbs Established commenter

    not entirely correct - 2% was the "initial forecast" rise, so will come from schools' budgets, the extra 0.75% that makes it up to the full 2.75% is funded in addition by the govt. See https://schoolsweek.co.uk/governmen...e-across-all-grades-but-its-not-fully-funded/
  18. DrResource

    DrResource New commenter

    strawbs likes this.
  19. Aquamarina1234

    Aquamarina1234 Star commenter

    My son is in imminent danger of redundancy. Although he has no desire to teach whatsoever, he is certainly giving the eye to the £28K bursary, one poxy year training and £30K for a year before he gets found out. £58K for 2 yrs' effort is a nearly 50% improvement on his current income and seems only to require some really effective bulls hit.
    agathamorse and Mrsmumbles like this.
  20. a1976

    a1976 Occasional commenter

    I think only the Science and Maths teachers should be paid this salary. That's where the real shortage is. Also, I wonder if there is a certain motive for these 'pay rises', like for example, automation. Yeah, require schools to pay teachers a higher wage and then, the schools look for 'alternatives'.
    Mrsmumbles and JohnJCazorla like this.

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