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‘I would burn in hell before returning’ – why British teachers are fleeing overseas

Discussion in 'Teaching abroad' started by englishdragon, Nov 13, 2019.

  1. hhhh

    hhhh Star commenter

    It's only fairly recently that this happened here-in my childhood you always saw local kids helping older neighbours, yes, even in very deprived areas.
  2. KolleyKibber

    KolleyKibber New commenter

    I thought I'd offer up my two-penneth on what is an interesting thread. I spent five years teaching internationally in East Africa, followed by a stint in Moscow. I returned home last year due to personal/family reasons rather than anything to do with the school I was at. I've seen the bad side of British teaching since I have been home; I worked part-time (thank God) in a pretty awful academy last year while completing my MA, but I am now in a small LA school in North Yorkshire that I am really enjoying working at.

    Still, all being well I will go back overseas in 2021. As much as I am enjoying my current school, the workload issues are still there. 33 kids in a class are 33 kids in a class, whether they are badly-behaved or not. The expectations on marking and assessment are still burdensome compared to the international circuit. I am forking out a good portion of my salary on things I took for granted working overseas. It has been lovely being at home and re-connecting with family and friends, but the main reason I came home (a family illness) has hopefully been resolved. There is nothing to keep me here now, it is only to desire to not have a fragmented CV that will keep me here for an extra year.
  3. makhnovite

    makhnovite Established commenter

    Kolley, long time no hear - yours Lobby Lud (Deja Vu, all over again!)
    KolleyKibber likes this.
  4. 4019775

    4019775 New commenter

    There are still plenty of excellent teaching jobs in UK. I am in top notch old school private having turned down a number of offers from "the circuit". (It is as good as the IB school in Oz I taught in: 18 kids HL Maths all IB 40+)

    Behaviour of kids is fantastic. In charge of Oxbridge applications for maths/physical sciences/ engineering and run a MAT club. Get to teach the very brightest of their generation and happy with the package I get (including travel to work, meals, pension and private health). Two hour flight from all the best in Europe and the grounds/buildings I work in are inspiring.

    I would be just as worried about how amoral/driven by greed more or less every school on the "circuit" is. By the way the reputation of the "circuit", and those on it, is rock bottom in schools like mine. We would never interview anyone from the "circuit". My head would not let them through the front door.
  5. taiyah

    taiyah Occasional commenter

    It's fine. Teachers in the "circuit" earning £50,000 tax free a year (x2 for couples), over their whole career will highly likely not need to entertain your Head with their CV.

    Besides, pretty confident that a Mill'... + Oxbridge graduate who has 3 years experience under Sir M. W. as a referee won't be an easy toss in the bin for your Head. Some of us just prefer the "circuit".
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2019
    T0nyGT, Mr_Frosty and dumbbells66 like this.
  6. dumbbells66

    dumbbells66 Lead commenter

    I wouldnt bother @taiyah, this poster, with their multiple accounts has no idea about what it takes to work on the circuit. They once got offered a job in a bottom tier school in Nigeria, then got screwed over by them. They never actually worked there.

    With all the recent bad press of high end private schools in the UK with the exam cheating, drug dealing etc, would you want to lower yourself to work in such places. I know i wouldnt..... not only that, you also have to work and live in the UK
    Mr_Frosty likes this.
  7. pauljoecoe

    pauljoecoe New commenter

    We're going back to UK (me and 'the wife') after 3 fabulous years in Hong Kong. However, we're retiring! No, I wouldn't teach again in the UK. I did 30 years there but wish we'd taken the move abroad earlier. The difference in job satisfaction and pay/conditions is stellar! (Well, in HK. Maybe not everywhere?)
    I've been doing some supply teaching here too. I would never do that in UK, a sure way to ruin retirement but here it is a joy.

    Of course there is a wide variety in UK schools but my last school as a good/outstanding one and I had good support from management but for me it's the negative attitude to education from too many of the students that I cannot deal with. I'm enjoying just teaching and helping kids get on rather than racking my brain on how to engage that kid who just doesn't want to know the makes that clear every lesson!
    Mr_Frosty likes this.
  8. Mainwaring

    Mainwaring Lead commenter

    POST 84

    [QUOTE: I am in top notch old school private...Behaviour of kids is fantastic. [/QUOTE]

    Clearly you are genuine article, old boy, but what happened to definite and indefinite article? Won't head let through door?
    yasf and ToK-tastic like this.
  9. T0nyGT

    T0nyGT Lead commenter

    Enjoy de-icing your car
    dumbbells66 likes this.
  10. Mainwaring

    Mainwaring Lead commenter

    No doubt chauffeur wallah de-ices gold-plated Royce Roller on his behalf.
  11. ToK-tastic

    ToK-tastic New commenter

    Is this a spoof post, or is the OP actually oblivious of the contradictions inherent to the argument ?

    The poster accuses "the circuit" of amorality and greed, yet demonstrates both in their post.
    Many would argue that championing an elite over others lacks a moral approach to the education of young people. It's not immoral, but neither is it commonly thought to be moral, and as such may be termed amoral. Of course, it depends who is deciding the moral code, but a championing of the elite appropriately positions the OP in that respect.

    The poster accuses "the circuit" of greed, yet in the previous paragraph proclaims the excellent material benefits of their package, with no reference to intrinsic benefits nor to counterbalancing costs. Obsession with benefits with no reference to costs may be a good definition of 'greed'.

    It's rather rich to accuse the not-for profit Foundations and Schools (who are on "the circuit") of greed. Many of the people working in these schools are doing so as an alternative to far more lucrative careers that they may have left, or retain as a secondary career. What about parents, Board Members, local community groups etc who give their time without payment ?
    yasf likes this.
  12. Mainwaring

    Mainwaring Lead commenter

    'Is this a spoof post, or is the (poster) actually oblivious of the contradictions inherent to the argument?'

    As I used to remind my TOK students, assertion is not argument. There was no argument, just a lot of smug and arguably fictional blether. (I'm with Dumbers on this one).
    ToK-tastic likes this.
  13. englishdragon

    englishdragon Occasional commenter

    Is anyone rushing back to teach in the UK?

    Free breakfasts to form part of Labour plan to 'poverty-proof' schools

    Party will also vow to recruit 20,000 more teachers, cap class sizes and spend £7bn on repairs and upgrades
    Heather Stewart and Richard Adams Wed 4 Dec 2019 22.30 GMT
    Labour is to promise free, healthy breakfasts for all primary-age children as part of a multibillion pound plan to “poverty-proof” England’s schools and boost educational standards.
    The shadow education secretary, Angela Rayner, will on Thursday pledge to recruit 20,000 more teachers, cap secondary class sizes at 30, and spend £7bn on repairs and upgrades to England’s crumbling school buildings.
    As well as expanding the provision of free breakfasts to all primary schools across England to help combat hunger, Labour would also pilot free breakfasts in secondary schools and introduce a new programme of “extended schools”, in the evenings and the summer holidays, to help all children to access activities such as sport.
  14. adrixargentina

    adrixargentina Occasional commenter

    Parents aren't parenting anymore. Or teachers are just glorified babysitters. It's a travesty that extended school rubbish.
    percy topliss and englishdragon like this.
  15. Mainwaring

    Mainwaring Lead commenter

    When Mrs M heard this one she commented that this was exactly what politicians were promising when she began teaching primary in 1966.
  16. ed717

    ed717 New commenter

    Totally agree. It seems to just be 'plonk them in front of the ipad' approach now, and blame the teacher when they can't sit still for 5 seconds because of all the frozen ready meals full of hormones and mad cow disease they feed them...
  17. snitzelvonkrumm

    snitzelvonkrumm Occasional commenter

    Avoid all UK schools. Avoid rent a name schools. Avoid for profit schools. Look for the genuine, well established, international, non profit school with limited turn over of staff.
    dumbbells66 likes this.
  18. T0nyGT

    T0nyGT Lead commenter

    Unfortunately, there are LOTS of people applying to those schools.

    Not all British schools are bad - I have friends in some decent ones. Sure, they won't pay as well as proper international schools - but they're not exactly terrible
  19. yasf

    yasf Established commenter

    Some do. I was offered $72k + housing etc by a british school. Beware bar stool conversations with North Americans about British schools.
    T0nyGT likes this.
  20. nemo.

    nemo. Occasional commenter

    Does you school pay a base salary of 100,000 pounds a year? If not I couldn't afford the pay cut to work there. And then there is xenophobic Brexit to worry about, collapse of the NHS.....
    englishdragon and dumbbells66 like this.

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