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How does your school improve its processes?

Discussion in 'Personal' started by LeanProcessManager, Sep 5, 2017.


What approach does your school have to improving processes?

  1. Senior managers tell people what to do

    16 vote(s)
  2. New processes are developed together with, or by the people who have to operate them

    2 vote(s)
  3. Representative working parties are formed

    2 vote(s)
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Mangleworzle

    Mangleworzle Star commenter

    Quick answer - Yes.

    At the end of every parents evening for the last 10 years or so feedback has been requested and received, sometimes changes are made as a result.

    Quick test - do you really think you know something new about parents evenings?
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2017
  2. Mangleworzle

    Mangleworzle Star commenter

    Exactly, teaching is about building relationships. Applying irrelevant ideas from elsewhere is one of the major problems in teaching, largely driven by snake oil sellers looking to make a profit now they can get into schools in ways they couldn't previously.

    This whole idea of consultants and mangers of things no-one had ever heard of before someone decided to make it their job bring to mind teenagers discovering sex for the first time. In their own minds they haven't just discovered it, but invented it, no-one else has ever known about it before and no-one knows as much about it as they have learned in the last hardly-any-time-at-all. Look - I've written it down!

    Coming soon!
    Managing your walk from the car park to classroom for maximum efficiency.
    How to wee in the most effective manner.
    How to deal with teaching, discipline and things that matter... oh, wait, scrub those, too hard... you do it and we'll pass judgement.
    peggylu, drek, yodaami2 and 4 others like this.
  3. LeanProcessManager

    LeanProcessManager New commenter

    You make good points and I am really talking about averages. I agree that a large churn is a bad thing, every teacher leaving is a loss of valuable experience. However too low a churn is also a bad thing, as you point out, it may result in the organisation becoming stale - it is human nature to think that the way we do things now must be right way. New people bring in new ideas.
  4. LeanProcessManager

    LeanProcessManager New commenter

    "How to deal with teaching, discipline and things that matter... oh, wait, scrub those, too hard... you do it and we'll pass judgement."

    Not exactly. More correctly "Plan-Do-Study-Adjust", not "make something up on the spot - all do our best - tell ourselves we have done a good job - keep doing it the same way for 10 years"

    It should not be necessary to "pass judgement" because the "study" part of the improvement cycle should allow the team to suggest its own improvements.
  5. Crowbob

    Crowbob Lead commenter


    And lawyers become lawyers to make the world a better place as well - what proportion of lawyers achieve that aim? :)
    Flere-Imsaho, blazer, drek and 2 others like this.
  6. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Team? What team?

    My last class. SEN KS5 MLD.

    It was new to the school. I had to make it up. Nobody else was interested. They were busy enough with their own classes. If you have a capable individual then you can leave him/her to get on with it. You may need teams in some workplaces and for some roles. But not all.

    Whatever happened to professional expertise and independence and trust?
    emerald52 likes this.
  7. sbkrobson

    sbkrobson Star commenter

    EmanuelShadrack likes this.
  8. Mangleworzle

    Mangleworzle Star commenter

    You aren't listening.

    You sound like a typical inexperienced, know-all didactic manager
    peggylu and drek like this.
  9. racroesus

    racroesus Star commenter

    Many years ago it was part of Computing courses; Input - Process - Output.
    peggylu, drek and EmanuelShadrack like this.
  10. racroesus

    racroesus Star commenter

    How does a school change its inputs?
    peggylu, drek and chelsea2 like this.
  11. racroesus

    racroesus Star commenter

    How does a school change the environment in which its part complete outputs are stored?
    drek likes this.
  12. racroesus

    racroesus Star commenter

    Consider a modern child produced by the education industry and one produced 30 years ago.
    grumpydogwoman likes this.
  13. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter


    I haven't been married for 11 years to someone with a qualification in Business Process Engineering without learning something.

    Here's a real-life example:

    • You are putting in a new coffee shop at a new airport
    • Sales etc go through networked tills
    • The till won't work
    • What do you do?
    • You have one number to call
    • That is 1st-line support
    • They tell you to turn it off and turn it on again
    • You tell them that hasn't fixed it
    • They suggest something else
    • Then they escalate to 2nd-line
    And so on and so on. That is a process. You do not email someone you know and ask them. That's not part of the process. Even though he's your mate and he works somewhere in IT. That's not the process. You do not ring the direct line of a girl you once went out with who's at Head Office. You follow the process.

    Business processes can be very useful.

    In teaching?
    The process is we submit the register (hard copy) by 09:05.
    In the event of a fire we line up on the big playground at point B

    Lots of useful processes.

    Sometimes I'd want to tell you where to shove your precious processes.
    phlogiston likes this.
  14. racroesus

    racroesus Star commenter

    We did and had to be told that only positive comments would be allowed after the first set.
    I was grilled for a week by a new HT after I asked if the results of the coming staff survey would be shared with us as well as the results of the previous two which had been hidden away. Pupil and Parent results were generally positive so we had been told about them.
    peggylu likes this.
  15. racroesus

    racroesus Star commenter

    May be a bad thing, surely, if it may result in staleness.
  16. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Happy sheets????

    P M S L.

    That isn't a real thing. Nooooooo! This is a wind-up! Hey, it's gone 3 pages. Reasonable effort.
    peggylu and bombaysapphire like this.
  17. Doitforfree

    Doitforfree Star commenter

    I don't work in a school. I'm a music teacher and foster carer. Feedback forms, yes. My feedback is routinely wrong because I don't appreciate the new and amazing things I've been told but have the temerity to suggest that I and all my fellow foster carers knew all that stuff before the 'trainer' was out of nappies. Bad process, becasue it isn't set up to take negative feedback. My poor husband tears his hair out when people slavishly follow processes which are unfortunately not fit for purpose.

    It's a bit like surveys. It is surprisngly hard to construct a good one. I get fed up of Yougov being quoted all the time as I know that their surveys are terrible on every level, meaning they aren't getting any meaningful data from them.
    colpee likes this.
  18. Doitforfree

    Doitforfree Star commenter

    My parents were undoubtedly better educated than I was in their cold and draughty wartime schools, with elderly teachers and no resources (and compulsary rice pudding, which they loved because they were hungry). I was undoubtedly better educated than my own children because there was still a lot of rigour and we were expected to do things for ourselves at primary school that even sixth formers today wouldn't manage. We all went to normal state schools, I weep to see what education has become, because of the nonsense that is brought in by the government and people who think that putting effort into changing the name of a pupil to student and then learner and then goodness knows what matters AT ALL.
    peggylu, blazer, sbkrobson and 3 others like this.
  19. colpee

    colpee Star commenter

    Oh I know what it is, hence the question. I have been in a couple of large government organisations that went hard for 'Lean' over a couple of of years. 'Lean Teams' would visit and try to apply industrial supply train strategies to various engineering, logistics and training areas. Managers desperate for reductions in staff and budgets forced implentation and accepted the ignorancies of lean teams over the depth knowledge and understanding of the operational managers and staff. It wasn't too long before the term de-leaning was to be heard and the Lean initiatives died and now lie in dusty 'lessons learned' files.

    As I was saying .....:rolleyes:

    I accept you may believe that, but reality is that Lean is looks at people like cogs in a machine - respect bah!
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2017
    peggylu likes this.
  20. bombaysapphire

    bombaysapphire Star commenter

    Interesting. I have successfully organised 8 parents' evenings a year for several years without spending time writing a list like that. I don't know how I managed!

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