# How do you assign your maths sublevels?

Discussion in 'Primary' started by anon3518, Dec 12, 2010.

1. ### anon3518

A big area of improvement for our school is assessment. Currently, most assessment is by way of the optionals and for year 2, sats papers. We have introduced self-assessment sheets where by the children can tick off when they think they have met an objective 3 times but from a teacher perspective what the children think they can do and what they can actually do is not always the same!
We are looking at how to assign a sublevels as they are hit and miss and we are trying to ensure consistency. At present we have not gone down the APP (may not even) route as we are trying to focus on writing. In a nutshell, how do you assess in maths? I don't mean through guided maths etc but the actual sublevel. Yes I know sublevels are not statutory but sublevels are what are wanted. Do you give mini tests a couple of weeks after you've taught something adn then match it against descriptors from somewhere? Any help and suggestions greatly received. HC

2. ### anon3518

A big area of improvement for our school is assessment. Currently, most assessment is by way of the optionals and for year 2, sats papers. We have introduced self-assessment sheets where by the children can tick off when they think they have met an objective 3 times but from a teacher perspective what the children think they can do and what they can actually do is not always the same!
We are looking at how to assign a sublevels as they are hit and miss and we are trying to ensure consistency. At present we have not gone down the APP (may not even) route as we are trying to focus on writing. In a nutshell, how do you assess in maths? I don't mean through guided maths etc but the actual sublevel. Yes I know sublevels are not statutory but sublevels are what are wanted. Do you give mini tests a couple of weeks after you've taught something adn then match it against descriptors from somewhere? Any help and suggestions greatly received. HC

3. ### anon63

You need APP. Your school seem like they are trying to cobble together some kind of assessment system that's not going to be as good as APP. I realise a lot of teachers have moaned about how much work APP is, but really it isn't unless you did nothing in the way of assessment beforehand.

4. ### pinkflipflop

As much as I have hated the process of becoming familiar with APP I gree with beestoni. If you don't have a strong assessment process in place that is better than APP then you need to be using APP.

5. ### pinkflipflop

Forgot to say in there that I don't think 'minitests' are all that useful in the grand scheme of things. We do use some at times to supplement our teacher assessment and evidence base but they certainly are not the be all and end all.

6. ### sulla

We assess in Maths all the time, using AfL.

Surely what you want to ensure is that the children are making progress in Maths - recording it as sublevels doesn't achieve this, even if the sublevels are accurate. I would place greater emphasis on assessment for learning, sticking with the self-assessment sheets among other things.

Don't go with APP. It doesn't provide sublevels anyway - one of the few good things about it as sublevels are a complete nonsense anyway.

It does

8. ### MilgodEstablished commenter

No it doesn't. It provides low, secure, high which are in no way like sub-levels (a,b,c). They certainly don't work if the school assigns points (2 points per sub-level).

We use APP for Maths, Reading and Writing. I don't mind it for writing too much but the others are IMO too hard to moderate properly.

9. ### clatkiu1

You do not need APP. It is not statutory. It is time consuming and really difficult to decide if a child has met a certain statement as they can do it a few times when teaching the topic or even a few weeks later, but have no idea how to do it six months later. We were an APP hub school and have decided not to continue it this year, it may well disappear with hald the consultants anyway.
This year we are doing unit tests. We have had to buy them in, but they are really quick to do and give a sub level.

10. ### pinkflipflop

Well that has blown our 3 years of work out of the window! We are a pilot school for APP and use it for sublevels which are entered onto the system.
We were even moderated this year....

11. ### anniesophie

clatkiu1
'This year we are doing unit tests. We have had to buy them in, but they are really quick to do and give a sub level.'

Which unit tests do you use?

12. ### MilgodEstablished commenter

They aren't meant to be used that way but 'for the purpose of recording and tracking data' they can be.

It just shows what a farce APP really is, even the National Strategies can't agree on how it should be used. I can't wait for us to stop using it.

13. ### pinkflipflop

Agreed. It is a complete farce.

14. ### anon3518

thank you for all your replies. Ultimately it's the head's decision but as newly appointed maths coordinated I'm getting rather stressed trying to figure how it will all pan out especially since there is such mixed opinion over the APPs, particularly with maths.
Clatkiu1 - what assessments do you use?
HC

15. ### clatkiu1

I will check tomorrow which one we use and post. I can't for the life of me remember!

16. ### clatkiu1

They are from the 'rising stars' series.

17. ### kentishlass

APP is designed as a sampling assessment tool. It is NOT meant to assess the whole class. Any head implementingit in this way has got it wrong big time.
You are only meant to assess a selection across the class from the various ability ranges. As you become more familiar with the assessment levelling, this means you can guage the rest of the class without doing APP for the whole lot.
It's not a manageableassessment tool for the whole class.

"How do you assign your maths sublevels?"

In an entirely cavalier fashion, that incorporates equal parts: judgement; panache and flair; guesswork; derring-do; identifying which way the wind is blowing today.
As does everyone, don't they?

19. ### pinkflipflop

It isn't the Heads implementing it in this way, it is the LA. If you read the guidance for APP it does actually say in there that it is for every child.

20. ### elizabeth1972

It is the heads in some cases. We're APPing every child in reading, writing, science and maths: as requested by the head, not the LA. It's an enormous workload and entirely unmanageable.
However, I actually quite like APP - especially for writing. If I did it really thoroughly for a focus group, it would give me such a good understanding of their gaps or what is needed to boost them up a level. But, when you're doing it for 30+ children, it's impossible to do well or thoroughly.