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Discussion in 'Early Years' started by mancminx, Jul 20, 2011.
This is a useful 'one page' arrangement of the common spellings, plus a few rare ones:
Thank you SusanG too.
Get off your high horse, maizie. I could, given time, Sweetie.
To answer your other questions, I work in foundation, at present in nursery. I have worked in all the primary year groups at different times. I have been in my present school for less than a year. Children get less than average scores in SATs at both key stages; the school is in notice to improve. I don't use a reading scheme in nursery. The school has just started to use Floppys' Phonics and also use ORT. If I was in the position of 'fitting the text to the child' I would use different criteria depending on how and in what context it would be read. I use all sorts of criteria when choosing books to share with children.
Are you looking for my credentials?
Of course I could be anyone, as could you, my friend. We assume people are being truthful on here, don't we?
yes been there a few years ago and fortunately quickly out of it
Is that in both English and Maths?
Goodness, whose horse is highest?
I am not doubting your credentials for one minute. I am just trying to get a picture of how you work and what sort of results you get with with your method of teaching reading.
I have one of Debbie's charts which lists about 13 ways of spelling /or/, all of which are encounterd in everyday reading, your list only has 3! So, yes, there are more. (I've used 2 that you haven't listed in this short message, 'our' in 'your' and 'al' in 'all' )
I hadn't had my first cuppa of the day
makes note to wake up efore posting
yes, especially Maths.
yours. My light-hearted comment was to try and help you lighten up a bit.;-) I have worked elsewhere as literacy co-ordinator. Results higher than average. I would not claim credit.
Only 11 spellings have no variants (Bed, Jug/ jog/ jab, gorge, ring, single, pin, musician, this thing, van, television). I have listed all the variant spellings for other 80 English main graphemes at http://englishspellingproblems.blogspot.com/2009/12/rules-and-exceptions-of-english.html
I'll paste them into this post as well, but they will probably come out messed up.
Cat - plait meringue
dahlia champagne fete
play - cafe matinee
air - care bear aerial their there questionnaire
car – are + (Southern Engl. bath)
sauce - caught bought always tall crawl
saw - (UK also: or, four, more)<font size="3">C</font><font size="3">/at/ot/ut - character, kangaroo, queue
crab/ clap - chrome
lilac - stomach, anorak</font>
neck - cheque
Chat - picture
clutch - much
Dad - blonde
End - head any said Wednesday friend leisure leopard bury
her - turn bird learn word journey
Eel - eat even ceiling field police people me key ski debris quay
jolly - trolley movie corgi
Fish - photo stuff rough
Garden - ghastly guard
House – who
Ink - mystery pretty sieve women busy build
bite - might style mild kind eider height climb island indict sign
my - high pie rye buy I eye
Jelly, jig – gentle, ginger
fidget - digit
Kite/ kept - chemistry
seek - unique
***k - disc mosque
Lips - llama
Mum - dumb autumn
Nose - knot gone gnome mnemonic
On - cough sausage; want – wont; quarrel - quod
mole - bowl roll soul old mould boast most goes mauve
toe - go dough sew cocoa pharaoh oh depot
Oil – oyster toy - buoy
food - rude shrewd move group fruit truth tomb manoeuvre
blue do shoe through
good - would put woman courier
Order – board court
wart, quart – worn quorn
more - soar door four war swore abhor
Out – town; now - plough
Quick - acquire choir
Rug - rhubarb write
Sun - centre scene
face - case
fancy - fantasy
Shop - chute sure moustache liquorice
ignition - mission pension suspicion fashion
ambitious - delicious luscious
facial - spatial
Tap, pet - pterodactyl two debt
delicate - democrat
Up - front some couple blood
cute - you newt neutral suit beauty Tuesday nuclear
cue - few view menu
have - spiv
river - chivvy
Window - which
fix - accept except exhibit
Yak - use
Zip – xylophone, rose - froze
measure - azure
Endings and prefixes:
loveable - credible
vertical - novel anvil petrol
ordinary - machinery inventory century carpentry
fasten - abandon truncheon orphan goblin certain
absence - balance
absent - pleasant
father - author armour nectar centre injure quota
decide - divide
indulge - endure
merry – very - serrated
(regular – missing - surplus)
372 - 384 – 158)
Oh do keep up masha! I said a<u> rough </u>list (made from memory not cut and pasted from your book ) My rough list has a 130 different graphemes (so I've missed a few )and Susan has already posted a comprehensive list
I think the main point to be taken though is that it is actually not easy to find all the irregularities in written English, and yet some expect children to learn all these in isolation, and presumably, carry them all in their heads in some way. When we identify all the irregularities the list feels pretty meaningless until we have examples of the irregularities in words that we know. It does for me, anyway. I need the support of that context. Learning the GPCs in isolation is a bit like learning pin numbers -so much easier if the number is meaningful in some way. This is why I think learning the words represents an interaction of skills. As knowledge of simple phonemes builds into knowledge of simple words, those simple words become part of the repertoire we can use to decode further words, which are learnt and used in turn. When we encounter a new word with a novel representation of a phoneme, we use the knowledge we have for parts of the word that are familiar and we use our existing vocabulary and the context to help. That new pattern and word, then, can become part of our repertoire as we read on.
Actually I think the fact that I tried to give you a quick list of graphemes might not be a good indication ... I'm sure ifwe sat down and thought for a few minutes we could come up with all but the most obscure ways of representing the sounds in English.
but they shouldn't be taught in isolation they should always be taught with examples of words and context ...
teach - apply - practise
teach the new GPC apply it in words practise reading and writing in a sentence!
I really don't know where you get the idea from that GPCs are learned 'in isolation'. That would be a completely pointless exercise. They are, of course, taught and then immediately practised for reading and spelling.
But you expressed it better, Msz!
Yes, I know this is the teaching sequence, and on the whole I agree with it. But it remains: When children are reading, for some reason (with SP) they are taught to look at each GPC in an unknown word in order, in isolation, and with no reference to context, or to any whole word clues. In other words, starting from the GPC when it might help to start with the word, and, more than that, being discouraged from using other strategies which also might help. To do this, they need to have their list of GPCs, however many that is, in their memories. Children will not be the best readers they can be if they work like that, although, luckily, most children can't actually be stopped from using other strategies, which they discover on their own.
Sorry to disagree thumbie they are taught to read the phonemes through the word left to right but not in isolation and in the context of the word and sentence.
You're getting slithery again, Msz. And 'in order' would be left to right, I think.
Yes as an adult we know that it would be left to rightbut children need to be taught that is the order... not slithery simply pointing out how children are taught. We don't want swa instead of was do we?