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Getting a job after being dismissed for Gross Misconduct

Discussion in 'Pay and conditions' started by whitecoat, Apr 15, 2008.

  1. whitecoat

    whitecoat New commenter

    Have they offered you any kind of deal, ie pay off? If not they probably think they have a good case against you.
    If you resign now, you will not have a dismissal on your record.
    What do your union say? They usually encourage people to go for a deal if one is offered - save them a lot of paperwork.
     
  2. to be honest I think you may find further employment as a teacher difficult.
    But I suppose it really depends on the nature of the Gross Misconduct. I presume it is not Child Protection related as no-one in their right mind would post that on here. Without further detail it is hard to comment further, but I would not see the outlok as too bright.
    If you do get a compromise deal and a reference out of it this will ring alarm bells with potential employers.
    Probably best you follow advice of your union.
     
  3. gmf

    gmf

    Follow your union's advice - or (if you can afford it) consider a private solicitor specialising in employment law.

    But I fear you may have a rocky road to travel along...
     
  4. If the school report you to the GTCE you may be reprimanded, suspended or disbarred from teaching after a hearing, if they consider that the misconduct means that you have brought the profession into disrepute. See www.gtce.org.uk. It would be worth asking your representative to find out if this is at all likely.
     
  5. DaisysLot

    DaisysLot Senior commenter

    There are people with criminal records who float through teaching...

    There are people who have all sorts of minor and major crisis in their lives that affects their work, and are still teaching....

    "gross misconduct' has many definitions... and can often reflect the mere opinion of one head teacher and governing body....

    I would advise you resign rather than face the proceedings... Then potter about on supply and redeem your confidence until you find another position.

    It does not mean the end of your career... a common myth...
     
  6. Email me immediately, if you can. I've been through it!!!!

    I have a job, thanks to saner heads at the GTCE, and the House of Lords, and sane heads at my current place of employment (albeit it's overseas - I still had to go through investigation here).

    If you give me details via email about what happened, I can tell you the likelihood of being able to work after this...

    slieber24@aol.com

     
  7. Regarding resignation in the face of possible dismissal, it will not stop you from being reported to the DfES or GTCE.

    ALL sacking cases are reported to the DfES, then the GTCE, but if it's not a child protection issue, you might be able to do a compromise agreement that has a non-reporting clause in it.

    According to the GTCE, however, even compromise agreements supposedly cannot exempt you from being reported to the GTCE. And if you have a vindictive head teacher, as I did, then it doesn't matter what you do, you will still be reported.

     
  8. Torey

    Torey Occasional commenter

    Go and see an employment solicitor. Get the first half hour free. What is your union doing to support you?
     
  9. gmf

    gmf

    "According to the GTCE, however, even compromise agreements supposedly cannot exempt you from being reported to the GTCE. And if you have a vindictive head teacher, as I did, then it doesn't matter what you do, you will still be reported."

    Surely if the compromise agreement is properly (i.e. legally) drawn up, breaking it could give you the chance to sue for damages? Certainly an issue to take up with your Union/lawyer?
     
  10. Even the most vindictive Headteacher has to go through his local authority and they decide whether or not to put names to DCSF.
     
  11. Middlemarch

    Middlemarch Star commenter

    It all rather depends what the gross misconduct actually is. There are some 'offences' which would lead me and many other heads not to want to touch you with the proverbial bargepole. That's why gross misconduct is usually reportable to DCSF and GTCE and why - I'm afraid - LA's routinely send round letters to heads saying 'Do not employ Mr X'.
     
  12. Middlemarch is quite correct in this situation.

    And compromise agreements, regardless of how they are drawn up, will not prevent an LEA from reporting to the GTCE and DfES (or whatever they like to call themselves now), as it's in regulations that they must be reported. Failure to do so could lead to legal sanctions for the LEA/school because of the issues surrounding child protection (even if it's not CP issue - and, yes, I am also shocked by the silliness of it all - especially where the situation is one of employment and NOT CP).

    All gross misconduct issues have to be reported.
     
  13. whitecoat

    whitecoat New commenter

    But what if the "gross misconduct" was not proved?

    What defines "gross misconduct"? I have heard of vindictive heads using "gross misconduct" for trivial issues, such as paperwork errors, as a means of suspending and offering a compromise deal to staff they want rid of.
     
  14. gmf

    gmf

    Post 14 hits the nail on the head - 'gross misconduct' can be used as a hammer to beat individuals who have 'fallen out' with a Head, and such accusations can be cooked up with very little substance - they can also be serious with CP concerns (usually the basis of 'round-robin' LA warnings...)
     
  15. Middlemarch

    Middlemarch Star commenter

    That's why I said it depends on what type of gross misconduct it is. I would consider employing someone dismissed for some things, but not for others.

    Mind you, I've never, ever come across someone dismissed for gross misconduct because of failure to do paperwork.

    I have come across people dismissed for gross misconduct for drug possession on school premises, drug abuse, use of their school laptop to access pornographic websites, use of school computers to send abusive emails to colleagues, striking children, claiming to be sick and being found working elsewhere.
     
  16. frustum

    frustum Established commenter

    My husband's new contract states that smoking on company premises is gross misconduct and can lead to summary dismissal.
     
  17. As long as it is spelled out, then at least he knows what the issue is.

    My bullies could not really come up with an exact reason, and in the appeal hearing, they actually admitted it (I have the real minutes, almost verbatim what was said, done by an outsider this time, instead of an "insider" at the original hearing).

    I could see "breakdown of trust" due to the postings here, but they broke trust long before I posted anything, and the governors refused to help me when I wrote my own letter of complaint (a grievance, back in the days when you didn't have to put "formal grievance" in a letter).

    The stick was one that, from all reports, was turned right back onto the bully and her supporters. And, unfortunately, also onto the pupils, who suffered the most due to their ill-fated actions.

    My union rep argued to the GTCE that this was an employment issue, not a teaching issue. She also pointed out that trust broke down long before, and referred to my log of incidents, which went back nearly 4 years.

    I know that some people coming up against the GTCE have also had "employment" issues but still had a reprimand or worse from them. My case, otoh, was thrown out completely, before it even made it to the hearing level. To me, that shows the dismissal had very little, if any, merit. It only was bowing to the whims of one person, who went on to continue to wreak havoc in that school.

    As I pointed out before, I had to go through an investigation here, afterward, and passed it with flying colours. My current employers (who cleared me to teach here) are extremely happy with my work, especially with the results my pupils are showing.

    I did have two job offers from UK schools, though, even after explaining the situation. They scoffed at the thought that a head teacher could be so incompetent as recommend sacking a reasonably good teacher on such flimsy grounds, especially with the wealth of evidence that showed the complainant (the bully) was the one who should have been sacked.

    Sorry to witter (sp?) on so... I do worry about people caught up in such situations!!



     
  18. I can see how easy it is to get into a huge amount of trouble. Why do governers (in my case trustees)
    believe the bully? In my case I think they want to think he is good at his job and will not listen to the staff at all.
     
  19. Torey

    Torey Occasional commenter

    It is because if they admit liability, they know they will end up paying compensation.
     
  20. That is so true, although it's the LEA who really pays it, rather than the school, unless the school didn't take the advice given by the LEA.

    It's a shame really, because I would have stayed and helped that school if it hadn't been for the bullying. I gave up and finally decided I had to go after a particularly bad incident before Christmas, having got my residency in August of that school year, with intentions to stay on. I was going to leave quietly, but they refused to allow it.

    I think part of it was vindictiveness on the part of the Chair of Governors, as well, as I'm sure he had plans for the school and my resignation probably messed them up. Still, if he had listened to my concerns earlier on, and taken action like he'd promised, then none of it would have happened.

    Incompetence doesn't always end with the head teacher, after all...
     

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