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Full state pension?

Discussion in 'Retirement' started by Compassman, Aug 4, 2019.

  1. phatsals

    phatsals Senior commenter

    Yes you can pay shortfall years, the question is if it's worth it. There is a 6 year time limit to pay for them, on that basis the furthest back anyone can go is 2013, earlier years are gone. The exception to this is a small group of women who have had insufficient notice to the changes to their state pension entitlement. These are mainly women who do not have their own NIC but have been dependent on their husbands contribution record.

    Let's not forget, under the old system, the maximum would be around £125pw, regardless of a 30/40/50 year contribution record. To pay £749 for an additional £4.20pw seems extremely good value to me, it pays for itself in 3 years.
    eljefeb90 likes this.
  2. catbefriender

    catbefriender Lead commenter

    The bloke I spoke to at the HMRC last month told me it was 2006. o_O

    Interesting how so many people have so many different interpretations on how things are with pensions. The first HMRC bloke said I could pay the years off at £156, the 2nd said no, at £746. This is why I really sympathise for the women who got confused/ill advised about whether they were affected or not because there are reports of some of them ringing HMRC and being told, 'Don't worry love, you won't be affected.' So according to the HMRC bloke last month I could pay incomplete years from 2006 to 2015 and according to you it's only to 2013. As I only had two years in period 2006 to 2015 that were incomplete, I decided not to. He told me if I wanted to, he would send me the payment details and I could pay it online.
  3. phatsals

    phatsals Senior commenter

  4. applecrumblebumble

    applecrumblebumble Lead commenter

    As already said start with gateway to get pension projection to see how many years you have and the pay any shortfall from 2015 onwards, these all contribute to the new state pension. If you can get onto class 2 contribution all the better. At retirement you will receive a state pension and of course your teachers pension can’t be bad can it.
  5. Compassman

    Compassman Star commenter

    Thanks very much for the replies in this thread. I have forwarded it to my sister!

    As it stands, looking at the HMRC website I am on £146 per week but it could rise to £168 if I work for 5 years longer. Not sure what I am going to do at the moment as regards work. I have done 30 years in teaching and am not into my fourth year of my new job. It might be that I do another 2 years full time and then go part time for a few years.......
  6. catbefriender

    catbefriender Lead commenter




    So according to the website I CAN pay NI contributions at £3 a week from 2006 although I was told by the bloke from the HMRC last month I could only pay it at £15.o_O

    I will work myself up the strength to ring the 'intellects' at the HMRC yet again to see if I can get two of those years at £156.

    Give me strength!:mad:
    frangipani123 and Lara mfl 05 like this.
  7. applecrumblebumble

    applecrumblebumble Lead commenter

    Only if you are classed as self employed ( class 2) or one of the other types of employment eg. Examiner, exam invigilator, seasonal fisherman etc. If not then you will need to pay class 3 at £749 or so.
    If you have 30 years already and you are in employment for the next 5 years there is no point buying back any more years.
    catmother likes this.
  8. catmother

    catmother Star commenter

    I think the £3 contributions are the class 2,which are for self employed people. Are you self employed or were you self employed in 2006?
  9. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    You need to read your link to the contribution rates in conjunction with the gov.uk page explaining who is eligible to pay class 2. If you don't meet the eligibility criteria for class 2 you have to pay class 3.

  10. catbefriender

    catbefriender Lead commenter

    I have always been PAYE and/or self employed and told the 'intellect' in the HMRC that and he said, you can only pay Class 3 for those years. There is an option to send a message so I'm trying that out. If the people who work for the HMRC are confused and possibly getting it wrong/giving the wrong advice, it's not surprising so many women got it wrong or were given the wrong advice. If I can pay for those two years for £156 each, I will definitely do it.

    I find the information on different HMRC pages conflict and contradict some say you can go back to 2016, some 2013 and some say you can go back to 2006.

    In order to find out if you can pay a missing year, firstly you have to contact the Future Pension team. They tell you, 'Yes you can pay NI Class 2 contributions back to 2006,' and give you the general HMRC number and after a long wait they tell you, 'No you can't. You can only pay NI Class 3.'

    What a mess!
  11. catmother

    catmother Star commenter

    You seem to be repeated the same post over and over again.

    What is your current employment situation? Are you a teacher employed by a school and paying taxes/NI thought PAYE? Or are you self employed and filling in a tax return every year?
  12. catbefriender

    catbefriender Lead commenter

    It doesn't matter what my current status is, what matters is what my current status WAS during the two years between 2006-2019 that are incomplete. My status now has no bearing on paying for those two years.
    frangipani123 and Lara mfl 05 like this.
  13. catmother

    catmother Star commenter

    Ok. In that case (and I might be totally wrong as I am just trying to make educated guesses on here) were you solely self employed during those years?
    If your only job was a self employed one,I would guess you should be allowed to buy in category 2 contributions. However,if you were also employed on the PAYE as a teacher during those years,they would probably charge you at category 3 as they might that job as your main job.

    Of course,you situation then and your situation now might be totally different from the scenarios I imagined above.
    Prim and Sundaytrekker like this.
  14. phatsals

    phatsals Senior commenter

    If you were self employed you must have been registered as such. On that basis you were eligible and ought to have been paying Class2 or Class 3 NI depending on your income. If you did not, at that time, register for tax and NI, then you will have to pay Class 3 as you will have no evidence of self employment.

    £740 for £4.20pw for life is exceptionally good value.
    eljefeb90 and catmother like this.
  15. catbefriender

    catbefriender Lead commenter

    I reiterate, and sorry @catmother for stating the SAME thing again, the bloke from HMRC said last month that EVERYONE irrespective of whether they were self employed or PAYE had to pay Class 3 from 2006-2016. He said he could only pay Class one only for 3 years i.e. 2016-19.

    I reiterate, this information contradicts what I have seen online and a lot of information on HMRC websites contradict each other. Even the people on the HMRC Future pensions helpline and HMRC general helpline contradict each other.

    I have written to HMRC and hope I get someone who knows the definitive answer. I have been ill-advised by HMRC advisers many times in the past and been refunded and my only hope is that I can buy back the years I need to at £156.

    I do not agree buying a year back at £746 is worthwhile as it only provides for ONE contributing year, when one has over 10 years left to work. You could put that money into a savings account and deduct £156 annually which will provide almost FIVE contributing years. If you can pay £156 on previous years, that will be highly beneficial to me.

    @phatsals £746 for up to £20 a week for life is extremely good value.:)

    I reiterate, I am highly suspicious of the HMRC and believe that things may again change, and my current state retiring age of 67 may be raised to 68, giving me another year to contribute and the current requirement of needing 35 contributing years, may go up to 40!

    Like a lot of people the number of years the website state I have contributed fully, let's say it was 30 and the number of years the website say I NEED to continue contributing to get a full pension, let's say its 9, does not add up to 35. Yep, I know about the opting out thing, but it's still pretty and conveniently totally ambiguous.

    There are a lot of mystical things going on and the data upon which these calculations are made are unavailable. What worries me is that a lot of people may not get/be getting a full pension when they really are entitled to one and they have no way of proving otherwise. :(
  16. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    The new state pension scheme and its impenetrably complex transitional provisions is a master class in how politicians disguise changes that people won't like.

    Make it so hard to understand that no-one starts protesting on the streets as no-one can work out what it really means. Make sure explanations aren't all in the same place and you have to contact two different departments who don't "speak the same language".

    Design the transition so that those closest to retirement mostly gain from it compared to the old system. It's our children who will be worse off in the long run but by then no-one will even remember there was an 'old system' let alone know what they would have got under it.

    The DWP civil servants deserve knighthoods for their cunning design!
  17. catbefriender

    catbefriender Lead commenter

    Okay, I rang up the Future Pension Centre again, part of the DWP, who tell you which years you can pay NI contributions on and at what rates. The lady I spoke to reiterated, you pay the NI Class dependent on your employment status for those years. I told her HMRC said NO, everyone irrespective of their employment status pays those years at Class 3 and you can only pay NI Class 2 from 2013. So I will now have to lodge a complaint as I have stated that both departments of the government, i.e. the DWP and HMRC NI helpline should be stating the same thing. I am told I can pay them back at Class 2 by the DWP and I am being told I can only pay them back at Class 3 by HMRC NI helpline. The problem is, the NI helpline are the only ones that can process the payment at £156.:mad:

    And the DWP even said, you can pay NI Class 2 contributions if you are living and working abroad.

    Who should I believe?

    The link No 46 above states I can pay them back at £156 until 5 April 2020 and that is still live but I have no way of doing so as the department that accepts the payments won't accept them at £156.

    The DWP stating I should complain to HMRC and HMRC stating I should complain to DWP is the classic civil servant fobbing off technique. I am complaining to BOTH and state they should be communicating with each other and stating the same thing and stop wasting people's time and creating unnecessary anxiety in peoples' lives. I have to waste half an hour getting through to each of them, have protracted calls, for them BOTH to say different things and pass me back to the other and blame each other. I have had the manager of the Future Pension Centre call back and he has told me to send a written complaint. Another classic fobbing off technique, i.e. refusing to take the complaint over the phone. I now have to wait for the manager of the NI helpline to call me back, who will probably say the same thing. When both written complaints are lodged, maybe, just maybe, I will get a definitive response which will enable me to pay Class 2 contributions on those 2 years.

    I would advise everyone with more than 10 years to state pension age to grab as many qualifying years as you can, as cheap as you can, just in case they decide to change things again or discover they made a mistake as to how many actual qualifying years you really have.:rolleyes:
    frangipani123 and Lara mfl 05 like this.
  18. PeterQuint

    PeterQuint Lead commenter

    Whatever I say it ask here you seem to ‘find strange’.

    Either answer my questions constructively or move on.
  19. catmother

    catmother Star commenter

    I was simply surprised that you had not signed up for the government gateway which provides an up to date online statement,accesible 24/7 as you have been planning your retirement.
    You will have noticed that the poster @Rott Weiler was equally surprised.
  20. PeterQuint

    PeterQuint Lead commenter

    I’m not talking to Rott Weiler, I’m talking to you.

    I couldn’t be more clear.

    If you don’t like my posts, ignore them.

    If they’re offensive, report them.

    Otherwise, go away.

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