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Discussion in 'Scotland - education news' started by holdingon, Mar 22, 2011.
does anyone know the result?
No I don't know the result, but have just checked my Unions's website (the NASUWT Scotland) and 93.9% of teachers voted against the proposal with 74% or so being prepared to take industrial action. However there is no mention of what happens next.
SSTA ballot result: 95.4% for rejection. 61%of those indicated that they would be prepared to take industrial action including strike action.
?what? People vote to reject the proposal but decline to take industrial action? I suppose the proposals aren't THAT detestable then. Goodness me, what hope do we have?
ask how many would be happy with a work to rule and what would the %age be
loosing a days pay is not a desireable option -work to rule would have much more effect
I realise that the SSTA has, historically at least, been less keen on strike action than other unions, but I hope the EIS figures are higher than that, otherwise we are all screwed. COSLA/SG will look at that 61% figure and think that the threat of meaningful industrial action is minimal.
Remember, this was a indication only - if strike action had been considered we would all have had the opportunity to vote specifically for that before action commenced. I am disappointed that so many rejected the proposal but then weakened our negotiating position by blinking first.
Any idea what the turnout was in any of the union ballots? That is another critical number to add to the mix.
The fact that people are not willing to give up a days pay to safeguard their future job, pay and conditions show we have had it too good for too long.
Nothing on EIS website yet.
actually the ssta vote is 92.4% for industrial action of some sort
EIS voting closes at 2000hrs
Sorry - that should have been 2200hrs
Ah...looking at the SSTA website I see that your members were asked a different question than the EIS ballot. So it was 61.2% in favour of action (including strikes) plus 31.1% in favour of action short of a strike - an overwhelming 92.3% in favour of some sort of action.
However, tactically it would have been preferable if more people had indicated they would be willing to back the campaign all the way and take strike action if necessary. When I was a shop steward in industry we always asked our members to back us 100%, with the knowledge that we'd try to use that 'threat' wisely as a bargaining tool, thereby avoiding the need to actually go on strike and lose money.
On the otherhand, perhaps it's better for all that everyone is open and honest, and we now know how much stomach there is for strike action.
Anyone know the percentage of members that actually voted? I would hope 100% but not sure it will have happened.
There's no way it's 100%. I was asking around my colleagues the other day at school if they'd returned their ballot and a few of them didn't even know what I was talking about. Made me
the voting actually closed at 10 am not pm
Just lookedat the EIS website - could not believe it they are now recommending that their menbers ACCEPT a new reformed proposal - supply teachers get point1 of the salary scale for 5 days instead of 8 and no reduction in sick pay at all. What about Chartered Teachers, what about Conserved salaries? COSLA could not even wait until the EIS ballot result was out before trying to do a deal and the EIS are going along with it.
As I've said on Dominie's thread,I'm not impressed at all by this. Seriously considering changing union.
I've been in the EIS all my teaching career.I'm not the least bit impressed.Perhaps there's some mileage in alerting them to the fact other unions do exist and would happily take our money.
I dont work in Scotland now but have obvious sympathy with those who feel they have been 'sold down the river' by their union. It happened to me in 1987 when, as an active EIS representative, I was asked to sell a deal that we had already rejected at the ballot box! It was quite some deal: we were actually being asked to work longer hours than before we had taken industrial action!!!
Of course there were a few tweaks but essentially we were being asked to accept what we had just rejected. I left the EIS after that debacle and joined the NASUWT which was the only union which had rejected the offer. The top man was Jim O'Neill, a decent guy from Ayrshire. But soon there were problems. O'Neill was marginalised and the character who took control of the union later stood as a Conservative in the Holyrood parliament. Fortunately he did not get in. Then we had Carol Fox, arch feminist, appointed as top dog. She was worse than useless. Almost as useless as her brother Colin Fox who testified against Tommy Sheridan in court. Anyone smell MI5 at work here? Maybe just me.
I believe that the NASUWT leaders, like the EIS and SSTA for sure, are part of the Establishment in Scotland. I fought around 20 grievance procedures against my local authority and only lost around 5. Not a bad record. Two cases invlolving the GTC went to the Court of Session and these were both won. But the NASUWT barred me from holding office as I was not considered conducive to harmonious working relations between employer and employed. That was at least true. I was beating the *** more than they were beating me.
Ah...the class war. It never stops. Remember a headteacher is only a teacher who has lost the will to teach. But is in denial.
Best luck to all my fellow chalkies in Scotland.
I'm not sure I am able to give a confident answer to the dilemma you highlight. 25 years ago I 'jumped ship' from the EIS and was able, along with the support of others who had done the same, to put pressure on the local EIS as well as to win some skirmishes at local authority level. But maybe we would have been better advised to stay within the EIS and fight from there. I really dont know.
Ultimately I think there are two problems which are difficult to overcome. First, the union bureaucracy is wedded to the (still largely Labour Party) establishment in Scotland. No one can seriously imagine Ronnie Smith going to the barricades on any issue, short of protecting his pension. But leaders can be removed, so this problem is not intractable.
More of a problem is the composition of the teaching profession. It is possibly one of the few occupations where the employees are actually more reactionary than their employers! Nervous conformity is very much the order of the day. People like Tommy Sheridan and George Galloway are genuinely frightening to the average teacher since they seem to question the very system upon which the teacher's modest lifestyle has been built. In my experience nobody requires education more than the average teacher, and yet no one believes less that he has anything to learn. The union leaders have no interest in running political education courses since obviously this would undermine their own position; they are happier to heroically win cheap car insurance.
Without political education it is difficult to see much light at the end of the tunnel. But circumstances can be a great handmaiden to progress. I sincerely hope so, and wish politically literate teachers like sweden51 well.